Finding top four d-man

[slapshot]

How good a d-man do you think the Leafs could get for a package of something like JVR, their 2017 first round pick and a prospect (not on current roster)?

If Sosh slide into JVR spot, how many goals and points do you think he'd get playing with Bozak and Marner?

Not that I'd like to see JVR traded, but he just may be the mostly likely.

 

[Kin]

The thing about a trade like this is it's not like making the trade on Playstation where you just have to accumulate enough value on one side of the ledger and then a certain degree of player is available. A lot of defensemen just aren't going to be available for an upgrade on the LW(and a temporary one at that) and picks/prospects.

If the Leafs do make a substantial trade for a defenseman who's already fairly established it'll probably be less about the value they're able to put together and more about who, for whatever reason, is available.

 

[sneakyray]

I think maybe next year they can re-sign polak for cheaper than now and hopefully dermott can have an impact at the nhl level.

that makes RD: Zaitsev, carrick, polak,
LD:Rielly, gardiner, dermott

with marchenko/marincin/whoever else as off the bench guys

I've heard mirtle talking about Dermott making the team out of camp next year on a podcast so there it is.

I guess they could also try and find an upgrade at RD over polak and shift everyone else down on that side.

 

[herman]

I think maybe next year they can re-sign polak for cheaper than now

 

[disco]

Word is they're mining the KHL again this summer. Inserting another Zaitzev would be a plus. If they can't end up drafting a true big number one it might be defense by committee. All six being skilled puck-moving defense-men.

 

[Britishbulldog]

I think maybe next year they can re-sign polak for cheaper than now

I am looking at the realistic options to replace Polak's style of game and it doesn't look good.

As cool as Manson looks I am thinking that Anaheim wants to keep him or get a Taylor Hall for him.

 

[mr grieves]

They could, I suppose, luck into a Dougie Hamilton or a Nick Leddy or manage to get a Fowler or a Faulk as younger, cheaper guys push out the older, expensive guys on teams with deep defenses. But it's more likely that they manage a marginal improvement. I could certainly see the Leafs finding a top-4 guy via trade, but I doubt he'd be much of an improvement on Carrick.

Neither of those scenarios yields what they need to solidify into a perennial contender, a la LA or Chicago, but it might get them into the ballpark of the Caps -- an exciting, yet ultimately frustrating, decade could be what's in store, as we wait for Dermott, Nielsen, and this year's picks to develop and hope one turns into something great. 

 

[Frank E]

They could, I suppose, luck into a Dougie Hamilton or a Nick Leddy or manage to get a Fowler or a Faulk as younger, cheaper guys push out the older, expensive guys on teams with deep defenses. But it's more likely that they manage a marginal improvement. I could certainly see the Leafs finding a top-4 guy via trade, but I doubt he'd be much of an improvement on Carrick.

Neither of those scenarios yields what they need to solidify into a perennial contender, a la LA or Chicago, but it might get them into the ballpark of the Caps -- an exciting, yet ultimately frustrating, decade could be what's in store, as we wait for Dermott, Nielsen, and this year's picks to develop and hope one turns into something great.

But really, the Caps haven't won anything yet.

 

[bustaheims]

I am looking at the realistic options to replace Polak's style of game and it doesn't look good.

Here's a novel thought - how about not bringing in a defenceman whose style of game has limited benefits and is generally considered out-of-date, and, instead, focus on bringing in defencemen that can do more than hit people and ice the puck?

 

[herman]

I am looking at the realistic options to replace Polak's style of game and it doesn't look good.

Here's a novel thought - how about not bringing in a defenceman whose style of game has limited benefits and is generally considered out-of-date, and, instead, focus on bringing in defencemen that can do more than hit people and ice the puck?

Sort of begs the question why the pickings for players of Polak's style are so slim these days (yet so attractive at the deadline)?

I'd sooner take Hunwick back than Polak, to be honest, because Hunwick at least knows what to do but his body sometimes fails at it. His game got a lot better once he worked through/healed from whatever was hampering his skating.

 

[mr grieves]

I am looking at the realistic options to replace Polak's style of game and it doesn't look good.

Here's a novel thought - how about not bringing in a defenceman whose style of game has limited benefits and is generally considered out-of-date, and, instead, focus on bringing in defencemen that can do more than hit people and ice the puck?

Sort of begs the question why the pickings for players of Polak's style are so slim these days (yet so attractive at the deadline)?

GMs are dumb and those who are buying at the deadline have lucked into their core talent and/or quality goaltenders..?

Just because someone values something doesn't mean it actually possesses any particular value.

 

[dappleganger]

I don't get all the Polak hate. He leads the Leafs in PK TOI/GM. The Leafs have a top 10 penalty kill this year. He hits, blocks shots, he's not lost in his own end. He's a bottom pairing defenceman.

I think there is a reason he was a regular on a team who made it to the Stanley Cup Finals last year.

I'd be fine with him coming back next year.

 

[mr grieves]

But really, the Caps haven't won anything yet.

Yeah, a lot of really good teams don't win anything.

 

[Coco-puffs]

I am looking at the realistic options to replace Polak's style of game and it doesn't look good.

Here's a novel thought - how about not bringing in a defenceman whose style of game has limited benefits and is generally considered out-of-date, and, instead, focus on bringing in defencemen that can do more than hit people and ice the puck?

Sort of begs the question why the pickings for players of Polak's style are so slim these days (yet so attractive at the deadline)?

I'd sooner take Hunwick back than Polak, to be honest, because Hunwick at least knows what to do but his body sometimes fails at it. His game got a lot better once he worked through/healed from whatever was hampering his skating.

I think the majority of Hunlak's improvement in the last few months (49.6% since Feb 1st) has come from Hunwick getting over his injury.  Hunwick away from Polak in that time is 53.6% while Polak is 47.4%. 

Oh, and they have a ludicrous Save Percentage while on the ice together since February 1st.  0.984!!!  2 Goals against 5-on-5 in 262 mins together over that span.  Sure, its not sustainable but the Hunlak complaints have very little merit recently.

Goals against while on ice for each defenseman since Feb 1st (5 on 5, 5-on-5 ice time in brackets):

Rielly 31 (472 mins)
Zaitsev 30 (454 mins)
Gardiner 11 (480 mins)
Hunwick 9 (372 mins)
Carrick 6 (236 mins)
Marchenko 5 (152 mins)
Polak 5 (372 mins)
Marincin 2 (52 mins)

Just how good has Polak been this year, despite the hand-wringing regarding his possession.  He's been on the ice for 28 goals against 5-on-5 ALL year.  Rielly and Zaitsev have more than that in the last two months.  Despite Polak's flaws he's been a BEAST defensively in the stat that matters- Goals against.  Sure, its definitely not sustainable but I won't be surprised if they bring him back again next year.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

Despite Polak's flaws he's been a BEAST defensively in the stat that matters- Goals against.  Sure, its definitely not sustainable but I won't be surprised if they bring him back again next year.

That sounds like precisely the reason NOT to bring him back.

 

[Coco-puffs]

Despite Polak's flaws he's been a BEAST defensively in the stat that matters- Goals against.  Sure, its definitely not sustainable but I won't be surprised if they bring him back again next year.

That sounds like precisely the reason NOT to bring him back.

I completely agree.  I'm just saying Babcock is going to ask to have him back and Lou is probably going to want him back.  Dubas will be telling them Frig NO, but will they listen to him???

 

[bustaheims]

I don't get all the Polak hate. He leads the Leafs in PK TOI/GM. The Leafs have a top 10 penalty kill this year. He hits, blocks shots, he's not lost in his own end. He's a bottom pairing defenceman.

I think there is a reason he was a regular on a team who made it to the Stanley Cup Finals last year.

I'd be fine with him coming back next year.

This is basically the only aspect of the game where he provides value. However, you can't exactly attribute the Leafs' PK success to him. He was 2nd in PKTOI/game for the Leafs the previous two seasons, where the PK was 13th and 22nd in the league, respectively.

He may be a 3rd pairing defencemen, but there are better 3rd pairing defence options out there - including some that can actually contribute with more than physical play and icing pucks.

 

[bustaheims]

Just how good has Polak been this year, despite the hand-wringing regarding his possession.  He's been on the ice for 28 goals against 5-on-5 ALL year.  Rielly and Zaitsev have more than that in the last two months. 

Not really an apples to apple comparison, though. Polak's 5-on-5 ice time is significantly lower Rielly's or Zaitsev's, and he also generally faces a lower quality of opponent at even strength.

 

[herman]

Polak generally causes a lot of the PKs too.

Our bottom five in penalty differential:
Martin -22
Polak -21
Hunwick -19
Soshnikov -15
Gauthier -10

 

[Coco-puffs]

Just how good has Polak been this year, despite the hand-wringing regarding his possession.  He's been on the ice for 28 goals against 5-on-5 ALL year.  Rielly and Zaitsev have more than that in the last two months. 

Not really an apples to apple comparison, though. Polak's 5-on-5 ice time is significantly lower Rielly's or Zaitsev's, and he also generally faces a lower quality of opponent at even strength.

It wasn't meant to be an apples to apples comparison.  Your sleeping under a rock if you don't already know Rielly has faced much tougher competition. 

Rielly, 31 GA in 472 mins since Feb 1st.
Polak, 28 GA in 983 mins since start of season.

BTW, I've already stated a number of times on this board that Rielly has had some UNSUSTAINABLE bad luck this season.  And I just said Polak has had UNSUSTAINABLE good luck.  I'm just talking about the results.  People complaining about Polak definitely have good reasons to complain (icing the puck while not really under pressure, getting the worst of the possession share while on the ice- that has improved though, bad hits, etc)... but the RESULTS, no matter how unsustainable, have been good. 

I'll state it again though:  I don't want him back.