Bernier's Arbitration Case | Sides settle at 2 years, $4.15mil AAV

[GhostofPotvin29]

One thing to keep in mind: assuming that he gets a 1-year deal now, either through arbitration or the two sides working it out on their own, Bernier will be a UFA next summer.

I thought I read that arbitration can only result in a 1-year deal for him.

EDIT: Here

http://twitter.com/jonasTSN1050/status/626403483873374208

@jonasTSN1050

According to the CBA, Bernier is only able to elect for 1-year award because he's within one year of being eligible for Group-3 free agency.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

One thing to keep in mind: assuming that he gets a 1-year deal now, either through arbitration or the two sides working it out on their own, Bernier will be a UFA next summer.

I thought I read that arbitration can only result in a 1-year deal for him.

Correct. I didn't mean to suggest otherwise. I just meant that a 1-year deal could still be had even without arbitration.

 

[Frank E]

This situation seems a little odd to me...if this was really about a 1 year deal, how far apart on a 1 year deal could they be? 

It seems more like the Leafs have offered a multi-year deal that they're standing firm on, and are basically saying "it's either this, or whatever arbitration hands you, and you're out of here come spring."

 

[caver]

Man this whom who thing has me just saying who all the time, I relapsed sorry grammer police.

Is he arresting the star of Frasier?

Well played... ;D

 

[Leaflifer]

I couldn't care less about who plays net this year.

That's how I felt when Raycroft was in net. All I wanted was a roster blowup. That team was going nowhere with or without him. There were a few good players, but depth was nowhere to be seen.

 

[moon111]

Just bring back Pogge.

 

[Kin]

This situation seems a little odd to me...if this was really about a 1 year deal, how far apart on a 1 year deal could they be? 

It seems more like the Leafs have offered a multi-year deal that they're standing firm on, and are basically saying "it's either this, or whatever arbitration hands you, and you're out of here come spring."

That doesn't really make a ton of sense. Typically a player's upcoming UFA status isn't something that a Team uses as leverage. Why would they? UFA in recent years has proven itself to be pretty lucrative for marginal talents so long as they're the best available piece on the market and Bernier very well could go into next summer as the best goalie on the market.

I'm guessing it's more likely that Bernier wants a long term or at least multi-year deal and the Leafs are asking themselves a pretty fair question which is that even if they signed Bernier to a pretty team friendly deal like a 3 year/13.5 million dollar deal...how good do they actually want their goaltending to be in the next few years? They don't want Bernier stealing points. Ideally he might be a deadline move.

 

[Frank E]

This situation seems a little odd to me...if this was really about a 1 year deal, how far apart on a 1 year deal could they be? 

It seems more like the Leafs have offered a multi-year deal that they're standing firm on, and are basically saying "it's either this, or whatever arbitration hands you, and you're out of here come spring."

That doesn't really make a ton of sense. Typically a player's upcoming UFA status isn't something that a Team uses as leverage. Why would they? UFA in recent years has proven itself to be pretty lucrative for marginal talents so long as they're the best available piece on the market and Bernier very well could go into next summer as the best goalie on the market.

I'm guessing it's more likely that Bernier wants a long term or at least multi-year deal and the Leafs are asking themselves a pretty fair question which is that even if they signed Bernier to a pretty team friendly deal like a 3 year/13.5 million dollar deal...how good do they actually want their goaltending to be in the next few years? They don't want Bernier stealing points. Ideally he might be a deadline move.

I think we're kind of saying the same thing...unless it's a 3 year deal at a number like you're suggesting, the Leafs just aren't interested, and they'll take the one year arbitration deal and trade him at the deadline or before.

If this wasn't the case, and if the Leafs were really only offering a 1 year deal, and were indeed committed to trading him this spring regardless of his performance, they'd likely be able to find some common ground on a 1 year deal.  I mean, it's not like the cap difference between $4mil and $5mil is a big difference come spring anyways, and the Leafs aren't really pressed up against the cap either.

I'm thinking that the Leafs are trying to strong-arm Bernier into that team friendly 3'ish year deal, and are using the insecurity of a 1 year arbitration award deal alternative to do so.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

I'm thinking that the Leafs are trying to strong-arm Bernier into that team friendly 3'ish year deal, and are using the insecurity of a 1 year arbitration award deal alternative to do so.

This close to UFA though it's really Bernier that holds more power I think. Especially since a) Reimer is a UFA next summer too so the Leafs could go from having 2 decent goalies to none and b) even if he doesn't have a banner season Bernier will likely be the most attractive goalie on the market next summer so any "friendly" long-term deal the Leafs would be trying to strong-arm him into would probably be exceeded next July.

 

[Frank E]

I'm thinking that the Leafs are trying to strong-arm Bernier into that team friendly 3'ish year deal, and are using the insecurity of a 1 year arbitration award deal alternative to do so.

This close to UFA though it's really Bernier that holds more power I think. Especially since a) Reimer is a UFA next summer too so the Leafs could go from having 2 decent goalies to none and b) even if he doesn't have a banner season Bernier will likely be the most attractive goalie on the market next summer so any "friendly" long-term deal the Leafs would be trying to strong-arm him into would probably be exceeded next July.

I think that's all fair, I just think that there's a fair bit of risk involved in a 1 year deal playing goalie for the Toronto Maple Leafs this year.

 

[Kin]

If this wasn't the case, and if the Leafs were really only offering a 1 year deal, and were indeed committed to trading him this spring regardless of his performance, they'd likely be able to find some common ground on a 1 year deal.  I mean, it's not like the cap difference between $4mil and $5mil is a big difference come spring anyways, and the Leafs aren't really pressed up against the cap either.

Unless, as I said, it's Bernier who wants to get a multi-year deal and it's the Leafs who are reluctant, in which case it makes sense for Bernier to delay this hoping he can negotiate a deal more in line with what he wants to get.

The Leafs have lots of money, sure, but there's a line between investing it wisely and giving it away for no reason. If they think they can get the one year deal at arbitration at, say, 4 million and Bernier wants 5, there's nothing to be gained by them by meeting in the middle if the plan is ultimately to trade him.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

If they think they can get the one year deal at arbitration at, say, 4 million and Bernier wants 5, there's nothing to be gained by them by meeting in the middle if the plan is ultimately to trade him.

If the plan is to trade him it makes even more sense for them to try and get his cap hit to be as low as humanly possible. Every penny counts at the deadline for some teams and of course the Leafs have already used 2 of their 3 retention spots and might need to use another on one of their many other pending UFAs.

 

[Kin]

If the plan is to trade him it makes even more sense for them to try and get his cap hit to be as low as humanly possible. Every penny counts at the deadline for some teams and of course the Leafs have already used 2 of their 3 retention spots and might need to use another on one of their many other pending UFAs.

And there's no downside. If Bernier's not in the team's long term plans then you don't really have to worry about angering him and whatever motivation Bernier needs should be provided by his upcoming UFA status.

And like I said, while I want the Leafs to spend money freely when it gives them a competitive advantage, there is something to be said for watching them still behave responsibly within that context and run the business correctly.

 

[Frank E]

I agree guys.  So given all of this, it's reasonable to think that the Leafs plan on trading Bernier out this spring.

Like I said, if they were looking to keep him long term, and they couldn't agree on a long term number, they'd certainly be able to agree on a 1 year deal to keep things amicable vs. going to arbitration.

 

[Kin]

I agree guys.  So given all of this, it's reasonable to think that the Leafs plan on trading Bernier out this spring.

Like I said, if they were looking to keep him long term, and they couldn't agree on a long term number, they'd certainly be able to agree on a 1 year deal to keep things amicable vs. going to arbitration.

Except that's the opposite of what you said. You said that if the Leafs probably had a multi-year deal on the table and would use the threat of arbitration to get him to agree to those terms, not that they'd amicably reach a one year deal to keep negotiating.

Either way, I really think you're assuming there to be more acrimony in the process than there probably is. Bernier's probably enjoying some time off with his family right now and talking to his Agent occasionally about how things are going. Even with the fairly contentious Subban case they showed up, found a number and moved on.

I really do think teams and players know that this is just part of the business.

 

[bustaheims]

If the plan is to trade him it makes even more sense for them to try and get his cap hit to be as low as humanly possible. Every penny counts at the deadline for some teams and of course the Leafs have already used 2 of their 3 retention spots and might need to use another on one of their many other pending UFAs.

They might, but one of the nice things about the Leafs going into the season (and the deadline, I imagine) with a significant amount of unused cap space is that it really opens up the option to take a somewhat significant contract back instead of retaining salary - assuming the team they're trading with has one they'd be looking to move.

 

[Frank E]

I agree guys.  So given all of this, it's reasonable to think that the Leafs plan on trading Bernier out this spring.

Like I said, if they were looking to keep him long term, and they couldn't agree on a long term number, they'd certainly be able to agree on a 1 year deal to keep things amicable vs. going to arbitration.

Except that's the opposite of what you said. You said that if the Leafs probably had a multi-year deal on the table and would use the threat of arbitration to get him to agree to those terms, not that they'd amicably reach a one year deal to keep negotiating.

Either way, I really think you're assuming there to be more acrimony in the process than there probably is. Bernier's probably enjoying some time off with his family right now and talking to his Agent occasionally about how things are going. Even with the fairly contentious Subban case they showed up, found a number and moved on.

I really do think teams and players know that this is just part of the business.

I think my point is that it looks to be evident that they're only looking to keep him long term if he were to agree to the hypothetical "team friendly multi-year deal", or else they'd have signed him to a 1 year deal already.

I've got a few things on the go, so please forgive me if I'm not making myself clear.

 

[Highlander]

does anyone know when the arbitration case is going to be announced. I thought the ruling would be today

 

[WhatIfGodWasALeaf]

does anyone know when the arbitration case is going to be announced. I thought the ruling would be today

Hearing today, ruling within 48 hours.

 

[Sudafederov]

I would have paid Ticketmaster money to be in that hearing