Canadiens @ Leafs - May 31st, 7:00pm - CBC, Fan 590

[BermudaBudsFan]

I hear you ? don?t they ultimately need to be better than first round losses to be considered successful?  This series particularly, up 3 - 1.  Despite all the talk I can?t imagine it didn?t effect their performance.

Don't get me wrong, I'm certainly not trying to say that the Leafs have been particularly(or at all) successful as a team the last few years. They should have won their first round series this year. They should have won it last year. Beyond that, at worst, they had decent performances in serieses that nobody could fairly say they "should" have won.

I just don't look at that record and say that the issue here is necessarily psychological or that all of those losses need to be addressed by personnel changes. I could be wrong about that but I just don't think the cumulative weight of what I've seen, playoffs and regular season, says that. Especially, and I don't want to use this as an excuse but just an acknowledgement, after two seasons where they were playing to empty buildings and the conditions were a far sight from normal.

Again, fair comment.  I can say this ? this was the smoothest path to the final four.  Next year the Northeast is going to be super difficult.

 

[Guilt Trip]

I didn?t want them to win this year.  If they had won in the last decade then sure yes.  But for a first time in over 50 years I?d like to see a packed stadium losing their minds and I?d like them to play a full regular season without asterisks.

There's a good way of looking at it.. Is anyone beating Colorado, Tampa anyway?

 

[herman]

At least Nylander scored

 

[Kin]

The other thing, and I'm not trying to say this as an I told you so but just because I think people need to understand it, is that just the way the league is today...I don't think you should ever be more confident in any one team beating another in a playoff series than like 70/30. And that's probably high. And especially so if the favourite gets some bad injury luck.

Goaltending, depth, bad luck...each one of those things on its own is enough to swing a playoff series in an era with mandatory parity. The Leafs just kind of came up 0 for 3 here.

 

[Deebo]

I hear you ? don?t they ultimately need to be better than first round losses to be considered successful?  This series particularly, up 3 - 1.  Despite all the talk I can?t imagine it didn?t effect their performance.

Don't get me wrong, I'm certainly not trying to say that the Leafs have been particularly(or at all) successful as a team the last few years. They should have won their first round series this year. They should have won it last year. Beyond that, at worst, they had decent performances in serieses that nobody could fairly say they "should" have won.

I just don't look at that record and say that the issue here is necessarily psychological or that all of those losses need to be addressed by personnel changes. I could be wrong about that but I just don't think the cumulative weight of what I've seen, playoffs and regular season, says that. Especially, and I don't want to use this as an excuse but just an acknowledgement, after two seasons where they were playing to empty buildings and the conditions were a far sight from normal.

Even last year was a toss up to me. Shorter series and CBJ/Toronto were very close in the standings for going on 2 years.

This year was pathetic though IMO.

 

[Guilt Trip]

No but they need a better goalie bud

Jack's fine. They need a better team around him.

If Freddie was in net you wouldn't be saying that.
Last I checked fine isn't good enough. He let in 6 very stoppable goals. And at the podium he said it himself.  I need to be better in game 5 and game 7.

Fred is washed up and gone this off season. This was Jack's first taste of playoff hockey. The first goal tonight,he should have stopped. Looking at his play this series, as a whole, I thought he played really well. The Canadiens defended better than the Leafs did, and Price was better. That's why they lost.

He did pay well but the other guy was better...
1st goal tonight, winning goal game 1, 2nd and 3rd goal game 5, 2nd goal game 6 were all soft..Price let in 1 soft goal. Can't let in soft goals when the other guy isn't..

 

[Kin]

Again, fair comment.  I can say this ? this was the smoothest path to the final four.  Next year the Northeast is going to be super difficult.

That's true. If winning this series was particularly important just in terms of getting a monkey off their back or if we looked at this path as a really golden opportunity because winning these two winnable series would put them in a ok situation to fight out two more series wins and finally land that elusive cup...well that didn't happen. And that is unfortunate.

But, you know, if this loss does represent the end of an era in Leafs hockey(and I hope it doesn't) then I really hope that the lesson taken from it is the lesson that should have been taken from the Kessel trade. There are no shortcuts here. You have to put in enough pain and only move forward when you're not worried about playing anyone. When your team is the best it can possibly be, not just good enough to start competing. Because if we were depending on an easy path, or even just the easiest path, well, then we probably weren't ready to begin with.

 

[Guilt Trip]

At least Nylander scored

not in game 5 or 6 lol..

 

[Kin]

This year was pathetic though IMO.

It probably wouldn't be helpful to point out that the root of that word, pathos, derives from the Greek dramatic concept of evoking compassion or sympathy, would it?

 

[CarltonTheBear]

Even last year was a toss up to me. Shorter series and CBJ/Toronto were very close in the standings for going on 2 years.

This year was pathetic though IMO.

Yeah, last year I was totally willing to shrug off the loss and say it was a coin flip and could have gone either way. But this year even if the Leafs managed to win game 7 my confidence in them would have just been completely destroyed and I wouldn't have expected them to win another series. Playoffs can always go either way but the Leafs had by far the easiest first round match-up in the league and are arguably the only team to completely blow it (Pittsburgh could be in that category, but at least from what I understand they played great and were just let down by Jarry).

 

[Guilt Trip]

It was a fun year but I'm glad they'll be going back to normal next year.

 

[Peter D.]

No excuses...absolutely no excuses. Even without the captain and Muzzin, they should have steamrolled the Habs.  Price proving why I still believe he is the best goalie in the league.

Never been much of a Matthews fan, and this showing certainly doesn?t help.

I honestly believe Marner just may be traded. Something?s got to give with this core.

This was their best and easiest road to the semis, and they frittered it away with a huge whimper.

 

[Kin]

(Pittsburgh could be in that category, but at least from what I understand they played great and were just let down by Jarry).

That is the dominant narrative but you can't get around the Islanders also effectively neutralizing Crosby(who's now got 6 points in his last 14 playoff games, all first round exits).

It's a tough league for star driven teams sometimes.

 

[Deebo]

This year was pathetic though IMO.

It probably wouldn't be helpful to point out that the root of that word, pathos, derives from the Greek dramatic concept of evoking compassion or sympathy, would it?

Probably not, no.

I was going for this definition:

adjective

miserably inadequate; of very low standard.
"he's a pathetic excuse for a man"

 

[BermudaBudsFan]

Again, fair comment.  I can say this ? this was the smoothest path to the final four.  Next year the Northeast is going to be super difficult.

That's true. If winning this series was particularly important just in terms of getting a monkey off their back or if we looked at this path as a really golden opportunity because winning these two winnable series would put them in a ok situation to fight out two more series wins and finally land that elusive cup...well that didn't happen. And that is unfortunate.

But, you know, if this loss does represent the end of an era in Leafs hockey(and I hope it doesn't) then I really hope that the lesson taken from it is the lesson that should have been taken from the Kessel trade. There are no shortcuts here. You have to put in enough pain and only move forward when you're not worried about playing anyone. When your team is the best it can possibly be, not just good enough to start competing. Because if we were depending on an easy path, or even just the easiest path, well, then we probably weren't ready to begin with.

It?s not much of an era ? I honestly think a rebuild should be on the table.  Seattle would be happy to take big contract to make a splash.  I see no way this team can possibly get out of a division with Tampa, Boston, Florida and a revamped Ottawa.  Bust it up.

 

[Kin]

Probably not, no.

I was going for this definition:

adjective

miserably inadequate; of very low standard.
"he's a pathetic excuse for a man"

Oh sure. I was just saying that, you know, our modern ethos has replaced what was once an invocation of sympathy with one of scorn. It can be a cold, cruel world.

 

[rdowdall]

I think the Leafs need to stay away from deadline deals.  Build the team in the summer.  Expecting deadline acquisitions to come in and lift this team over the hump is a bad plan.  The message from the start has to be that they are going to win with the people in the room in the beginning.

 

[Guilt Trip]

No excuses...absolutely no excuses. Even without the captain and Muzzin, they should have steamrolled the Habs.  Price proving why I still believe he is the best goalie in the league.

Never been much of a Matthews fan, and this showing certainly doesn?t help.

I honestly believe Marner just may be traded. Something?s got to give with this core.

This was their best and easiest road to the semis, and they frittered it away with a huge whimper.

I actually thought Matthews played well considering who he played with. It was too easy for the Habs to focus on him and not worry about Hyman or Marner scoring. He did everything but score but it wasn't from a lack of trying. Oh well, let's see what the off season brings.
And Marner isn't getting moved at what is deemed by many as a low point. His value couldn't be lower.

 

[lamajama]

At least they brought in 500 front line workers to confirm the Leafs are dead. 

I stole this FYI.

I?m not that clever. 

 

[Guilt Trip]

At least they brought in 500 front line workers to confirm the Leafs are dead. 

I stole this FYI.

I?m not that clever. 

And it's not that clever either .