Dave Bolland

[BlueWhiteBlood]

I don't see any way around that...the trades need to happen if this team is to move ahead.

I agree also.

 

[Andy007]

So the Leafs may "start" at 4 million for Bolland? Insinuating that they could end somewhere north of that figure? Whoa, that is a scary, scary prospect.

 

[BlueWhiteBlood]

So the Leafs may "start" at 4 million for Bolland? Insinuating that they could end somewhere north of that figure? Whoa, that is a scary, scary prospect.

As alluded to, I think that is more Dreger's opinion here. Nonis will probably start at 3.5 I would think.

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

So the Leafs may "start" at 4 million for Bolland? Insinuating that they could end somewhere north of that figure? Whoa, that is a scary, scary prospect.

As alluded to, I think that is more Dreger's opinion here. Nonis will probably start at 3.5 I would think.

Yeah it all depends on how "plugged in" you think Dreger is to the Leafs.  Someone had previously said he was fairly accurate regarding Bozak's contract negotiations last summer - and to be honest IIRC this is how those began too, with Dreger making statements about how much is too much for the Leafs, etc.

 

[BlueWhiteBlood]

Yeah it all depends on how "plugged in" you think Dreger is to the Leafs.  Someone had previously said he was fairly accurate regarding Bozak's contract negotiations last summer - and to be honest IIRC this is how those began too, with Dreger making statements about how much is too much for the Leafs, etc.

You'd think though that after only 23 games and injury status, that Nonis would automatically start lower than normal. I still think he comes in around 4-4.5 providing the term is there, but I really don't see Bolland commanding 5 million a season. His agent will start there, which I think was stated earlier in the media, maybe that was Dreger also?

 

[Andy007]

So the Leafs may "start" at 4 million for Bolland? Insinuating that they could end somewhere north of that figure? Whoa, that is a scary, scary prospect.

As alluded to, I think that is more Dreger's opinion here. Nonis will probably start at 3.5 I would think.

Yea that is why I said "may" and that it was a scary "prospect."

Hopefully Bolland is healthy. A healthy Bolland shouldn't be getting more than 3.5.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

Hopefully Bolland is healthy. A healthy Bolland shouldn't be getting more than 3.5.

Bolland may never be truly healthy again. Most spectators say it took Karlsson a full season to really regain his form after his similar injury. And Bolland's said that he's likely going to have to wear a special skate for the rest of his career to protect the scarring on his ankle, which certainly isn't going to help his skating.

 

[Highlander]

Sorry as much as I like David Bolland I don't want to commit to damaged goods?Hopefully Clarkson bounces back.

 

[Andy007]

Hopefully Bolland is healthy. A healthy Bolland shouldn't be getting more than 3.5.

Bolland may never be truly healthy again. Most spectators say it took Karlsson a full season to really regain his form after his similar injury. And Bolland's said that he's likely going to have to wear a special skate for the rest of his career to protect the scarring on his ankle, which certainly isn't going to help his skating.

Which is what is so mind boggling to me about the 4 million + projections. The guy 100% healthy isn't anywhere near worth that much; Bolland with a bum ankle? Why would anyone pay anything?

 

[BlueWhiteBlood]

I don't think we should already conclude that Bolland won't recover, the jury is still out on that at the moment. We only have Bolland's thoughts on that and I thought he was honest in saying that he made a emotional decision and came back too fast, but he also believes he is going to be 100% by camp, so we'll see I guess.

 

[lamajama]

Because it's what the Leafs do. Any normal sane team would inquire and make a reasonable offer in the same range he is now but no, TO builds him up to be a Mark-Messier in his prime and the Leafs will oblige.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

I don't think we should already conclude that Bolland won't recover, the jury is still out on that at the moment.

I'm not saying that he won't recover, but that I don't think he'll fully recover. His skating, which already wasn't great, will probably be somewhat impacted by this for the rest of his career. He can still be a NHL player, I just don't think he'll be as effective as he could be had the injury not happened.

We only have Bolland's thoughts on that and I thought he was honest in saying that he made a emotional decision and came back too fast, but he also believes he is going to be 100% by camp, so we'll see I guess.

Maybe we shouldn't really take him at his word here then. I highly doubt a pending UFA would ever say anything but that. If Bolland wants to prove he's recovered from this injury he needs to do it on the ice first. And before that happens I think any team would be out of their minds to commit to him long-term. If I had a gun to my head I'd rather sign him to a 1-year, $6mil contract than than $4.5mil for 5 or 6 years.

 

[BlueWhiteBlood]

Maybe we shouldn't really take him at his word here then. I highly doubt a pending UFA would ever say anything but that. If Bolland wants to prove he's recovered from this injury he needs to do it on the ice first. And before that happens I think any team would be out of their minds to commit to him long-term. If I had a gun to my head I'd rather sign him to a 1-year, $6mil contract than than $4.5mil for 5 or 6 years.

Well I'd certainly have a couple meetings with the team doctors and specialists, the injury status is most important. That being said, if everything checks out, I would still make my best offer, which we don't really know what the Leafs think that is. "They have a number in mind" is pretty much all we know.

 

[L K]

I don't think we should already conclude that Bolland won't recover, the jury is still out on that at the moment. We only have Bolland's thoughts on that and I thought he was honest in saying that he made a emotional decision and came back too fast, but he also believes he is going to be 100% by camp, so we'll see I guess.

Belief and reality are two completely different things.  Of course Bolland feels like he is going to be 100% by training camp.  He has to.  Not just for negotiation purposes but for his own mental preparation as he continues through rehab. 

The problem with the concept of 100% is that it doesn't necessarily mean a return to his form prior to injury.  100% can be pain free during games.  100% can be not having a mental block when making sharp turns/stops.  100% can be getting to the point where Bolland feels confidence in himself.  It doesn't necessarily mean that he will ever be the player that he was before the injury.

Bolland's injury history itself would be a concern for me in terms of his ability to actually get back to 100%.  One of Bolland's biggest weaknesses is his skating ability.  This is an injury that has a direct impact on that ability.  Paying Bolland with a long-term 4-4.5M contract is inherently doubling down on him getting back to 100% because paying a 3rd line center that kind of money is expecting big performance.  And that is where my concern lies. 

If the Leafs come to an agreement on a 1-year deal in that 4-4.5M range, fine. I think it's a bad use of cap dollars but it's short term risk.  If the Leafs sign him to a 2-3 year deal in the 3-3.5M range I think that is more reflective of the reality of his injury, but is unlikely to be something that Bolland accepts.  And if they go the other direction and sign him to a 4-5 year 4+ million dollar contract, that is the Leafs assuming all of the risk.

The notion that Bolland has these magical intangibles because the Blackhawks have won Stanley Cups ignores the fact that he was playing behind Kane, Toews, Hossa, Sharp, Seabrook and Keith.  Bolland was important to those Chicago teams, but "intangibles" is always that fantastic attribute that seems to only count when you are a 3rd liner when it comes to contracts.  I think it's a load of bunk.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

Well I'd certainly have a couple meetings with the team doctors and specialists, the injury status is most important. That being said, if everything checks out, I would still make my best offer, which we don't really know what the Leafs think that is. "They have a number in mind" is pretty much all we know.

You can check with the team doctors all you want, you still truly won't know anything for sure until he proves it on the ice. Remember, these same doctors cleared him to play last season long before he even got into a game.

 

[BlueWhiteBlood]

Well I'd certainly have a couple meetings with the team doctors and specialists, the injury status is most important. That being said, if everything checks out, I would still make my best offer, which we don't really know what the Leafs think that is. "They have a number in mind" is pretty much all we know.

You can check with the team doctors all you want, you still truly won't know anything for sure until he proves it on the ice. Remember, these same doctors cleared him to play last season long before he even got into a game.

All true. It's all you've got though in regards to injury status.

My initial comment was more in response to some just assuming that he's more or less done as a player, which isn't clear yet.

I'm not sold either on whether it's even the route that the Leafs should go, only that they seem to think they will explore it and what he's worth.

 

[bustaheims]

As is the whole rumour page of this site, but you still post there, right?

I would hope you'd understand the difference between discussing a rumour in terms of whether or not that move makes sense for a team and using one as support for your position.

 

[bustaheims]

Also never heard of this rumour, and nothing turned up initially on searching it.

I remember hearing it being discussed, but, it was more in the "maybe the Hawks should consider doing this" vein more than anything else.

 

[mr grieves]

My initial comment was more in response to some just assuming that he's more or less done as a player, which isn't clear yet.

Since the line of discussion the quote a part of is missing something pretty basic, thought experiment: say his injury is completely healed or it never happened. Would you pay $5m for that? $4m? -- it's not like the team doesn't have other holes to throw that money into.

 

[sneakyray]

the more I think about it the more I hope they let him walk.

mediocre!  even when hes healthy...thats what I think of him anyways.