Official Tank Nation Topic

[groundskeeper willie]

Yeah, my bad. Burke said that he turned down a "strong" offer for Reimer just before the deadline, but never said it was a first round draft pick. Even then, I still don't buy it.

There were lots of teams looking for goalies and a 25 year old with 13 career NHL games went for a 2nd round pick. Is it really that hard to believe that a guy a couple of years younger who has shown potential at the NHL level wouldn't draw some interest?

 

[Zee]

Yeah, my bad. Burke said that he turned down a "strong" offer for Reimer just before the deadline, but never said it was a first round draft pick. Even then, I still don't buy it.

There were lots of teams looking for goalies and a 25 year old with 13 career NHL games went for a 2nd round pick. Is it really that hard to believe that a guy a couple of years younger who has shown potential at the NHL level wouldn't draw some interest?

Yeah forgot about Ben Bishop.  There are probably teams who think Reimer is just having the old "sophomore slump" that they like to refer to and can bounce back next season and play well.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

Marc Antoine Godin ‏ @MAGodin
NHL execs from three different teams told me #CBJ are expected to trade their 1st round pick (likely 1st overall) at upcoming draft #yakupov

Godin's a reporter from Montreal, he's usually fairly reliable. If it's true, then I guess the whole Russian factor must really be scaring Columbus off. Sure hope it doesn't do the same for Burke. Drafting Yakupov would be huge for this team. More reason to hope for a lower pick to entice Howson with.

 

[pnjunction]

Marc Antoine Godin ‏ @MAGodin
NHL execs from three different teams told me #CBJ are expected to trade their 1st round pick (likely 1st overall) at upcoming draft #yakupov

Godin's a reporter from Montreal, he's usually fairly reliable. If it's true, then I guess the whole Russian factor must really be scaring Columbus off. Sure hope it doesn't do the same for Burke. Drafting Yakupov would be huge for this team. More reason to hope for a lower pick to entice Howson with.

I don't know man...it would just be typical Leaf luck to get the #1 pick and draft a future KHL superstar...

 

[bustaheims]

Marc Antoine Godin ‏ @MAGodin
NHL execs from three different teams told me #CBJ are expected to trade their 1st round pick (likely 1st overall) at upcoming draft #yakupov

Godin's a reporter from Montreal, he's usually fairly reliable. If it's true, then I guess the whole Russian factor must really be scaring Columbus off. Sure hope it doesn't do the same for Burke. Drafting Yakupov would be huge for this team. More reason to hope for a lower pick to entice Howson with.

I don't buy it. My guess is this will be like the whole Nash thing leading up to the deadline - they'll ask for the moon for the pick, no one will be willing to pay and they'll end up hanging on to it.

 

[Madferret]

Another "rebuilding" team looking to trade its 1st rounder?

 

[Wendel's Fist]

The sad reality with the Leafs is, we're not going to be winning a cup within the next 10 years.....minimum.

There are teams that are ahead of us on the NHL and AHL levels at the same time so how in the hell are we going to beat them anytime soon?

Phil Kessel and Joe Colborne were expendable in Boston and the Bruins still won the cup. Boston has Tyler Seguin to build around when their team slows down due to age. We are building our team around Kessel and hoping that Colborne might be a second line center someday. It's kind of pathetic when we couldn't win one game against Boston this year. Never mind playoff pressure.

Edmonton's team will kick the youth out of our team in a couple of years too. They actually have a first line in the making.

Unless the Leafs tank for this and a couple more years, I just don't see how we're ever going to win a cup.

It's nice that Burke isn't interested in draft picks because he doesn't want to wait. So........what else are we doing right now other than waiting Burkie?

Get that team fired up to win so we can look back on those March/April wins forever as the best days of our lives.

The anti-tank nation must be beaming with pride for all those useless end of the year wins from the past 7 years. Those wins really did carry through to the next season. Do they do anything for you now?

At this point, I'd have no shame in the Leafs dressing up anybody off the street to finish off the season and claiming that the rest of the team had the flu.

 

[Bender]

The sad reality with the Leafs is, we're not going to be winning a cup within the next 10 years.....minimum.

There are teams that are ahead of us on the NHL and AHL levels at the same time so how in the hell are we going to beat them anytime soon?

Phil Kessel and Joe Colborne were expendable in Boston and the Bruins still won the cup. Boston has Tyler Seguin to build around when their team slows down due to age. We are building our team around Kessel and hoping that Colborne might be a second line center someday. It's kind of pathetic when we couldn't win one game against Boston this year. Never mind playoff pressure.

Edmonton's team will kick the youth out of our team in a couple of years too. They actually have a first line in the making.

Unless the Leafs tank for this and a couple more years, I just don't see how we're ever going to win a cup.

It's nice that Burke isn't interested in draft picks because he doesn't want to wait. So........what else are we doing right now other than waiting Burkie?

Get that team fired up to win so we can look back on those March/April wins forever as the best days of our lives.

The anti-tank nation must be beaming with pride for all those useless end of the year wins from the past 7 years. Those wins really did carry through to the next season. Do they do anything for you now?

At this point, I'd have no shame in the Leafs dressing up anybody off the street to finish off the season and claiming that the rest of the team had the flu.

Just to be fair, I think it was perfectly fine to be excited about last year's team with a goaltender playing like James did for as long as he did and hope to get in. I honestly don't see anything wrong with that.

It's pretty funny though, it's as if people's views on the team aren't nuanced to some extent. Believe it or not it's not all YAY BURKE, and BURKE'S A DOUCHE. I wanted them to tank in 2008 and 2009 in order to get better picks.

At the same time I don't think you can really chastise people for wanting the team to be a success. It's not like their views make a difference in how the team is run one way or another. I happen to be a little less bleak in my outlook on the team in general, but I don't really see why you should have an issue with that.

 

[Wendel's Fist]

The sad reality with the Leafs is, we're not going to be winning a cup within the next 10 years.....minimum.

There are teams that are ahead of us on the NHL and AHL levels at the same time so how in the hell are we going to beat them anytime soon?

Phil Kessel and Joe Colborne were expendable in Boston and the Bruins still won the cup. Boston has Tyler Seguin to build around when their team slows down due to age. We are building our team around Kessel and hoping that Colborne might be a second line center someday. It's kind of pathetic when we couldn't win one game against Boston this year. Never mind playoff pressure.

Edmonton's team will kick the youth out of our team in a couple of years too. They actually have a first line in the making.

Unless the Leafs tank for this and a couple more years, I just don't see how we're ever going to win a cup.

It's nice that Burke isn't interested in draft picks because he doesn't want to wait. So........what else are we doing right now other than waiting Burkie?

Get that team fired up to win so we can look back on those March/April wins forever as the best days of our lives.

The anti-tank nation must be beaming with pride for all those useless end of the year wins from the past 7 years. Those wins really did carry through to the next season. Do they do anything for you now?

At this point, I'd have no shame in the Leafs dressing up anybody off the street to finish off the season and claiming that the rest of the team had the flu.

Just to be fair, I think it was perfectly fine to be excited about last year's team with a goaltender playing like James did for as long as he did and hope to get in. I honestly don't see anything wrong with that.

It's pretty funny though, it's as if people's views on the team aren't nuanced to some extent. Believe it or not it's not all YAY BURKE, and BURKE'S A DOUCHE. I wanted them to tank in 2008 and 2009 in order to get better picks.

At the same time I don't think you can really chastise people for wanting the team to be a success. It's not like their views make a difference in how the team is run one way or another. I happen to be a little less bleak in my outlook on the team in general, but I don't really see why you should have an issue with that.

It was perfectly fine to hope for the playoffs last year, if you didn't want the Leafs to ever win a cup.

Again, I don't get how that helped us now. Were we much better this year because of it?

Burke himself said that he doesn't just want to get into the playoffs and get knocked out right away. So.......what are we doing because if we get in, we're not going anywhere.

We can't even get into the playoffs and pretending like you can band-aid a team to a Stanley Cup is delusional.

Good thing Burke wasn't interested in waiting 5 years to turn this team around when he first got here. He needed immediate results.

Going on year 5 and fans still want a Stamkos without bottoming out. It just doesn't work out that way.

Tampa's won a cup before the Leafs have in the past 10 years and it wasn't because they were at the top or middle of the standings when they first came in.

They still managed to get Stamkos after winning that cup and we have Tyler Bozak. GO LEAFS GO!!

 

[Bender]

The sad reality with the Leafs is, we're not going to be winning a cup within the next 10 years.....minimum.

There are teams that are ahead of us on the NHL and AHL levels at the same time so how in the hell are we going to beat them anytime soon?

Phil Kessel and Joe Colborne were expendable in Boston and the Bruins still won the cup. Boston has Tyler Seguin to build around when their team slows down due to age. We are building our team around Kessel and hoping that Colborne might be a second line center someday. It's kind of pathetic when we couldn't win one game against Boston this year. Never mind playoff pressure.

Edmonton's team will kick the youth out of our team in a couple of years too. They actually have a first line in the making.

Unless the Leafs tank for this and a couple more years, I just don't see how we're ever going to win a cup.

It's nice that Burke isn't interested in draft picks because he doesn't want to wait. So........what else are we doing right now other than waiting Burkie?

Get that team fired up to win so we can look back on those March/April wins forever as the best days of our lives.

The anti-tank nation must be beaming with pride for all those useless end of the year wins from the past 7 years. Those wins really did carry through to the next season. Do they do anything for you now?

At this point, I'd have no shame in the Leafs dressing up anybody off the street to finish off the season and claiming that the rest of the team had the flu.

Just to be fair, I think it was perfectly fine to be excited about last year's team with a goaltender playing like James did for as long as he did and hope to get in. I honestly don't see anything wrong with that.

It's pretty funny though, it's as if people's views on the team aren't nuanced to some extent. Believe it or not it's not all YAY BURKE, and BURKE'S A DOUCHE. I wanted them to tank in 2008 and 2009 in order to get better picks.

At the same time I don't think you can really chastise people for wanting the team to be a success. It's not like their views make a difference in how the team is run one way or another. I happen to be a little less bleak in my outlook on the team in general, but I don't really see why you should have an issue with that.

It was perfectly fine to hope for the playoffs last year, if you didn't want the Leafs to ever win a cup.

Again, I don't get how that helped us now. Were we much better this year because of it?

Burke himself said that he doesn't just want to get into the playoffs and get knocked out right away. So.......what are we doing because if we get in, we're not going anywhere.

We can't even get into the playoffs and pretending like you can band-aid a team to a Stanley Cup is delusional.

Good thing Burke wasn't interested in waiting 5 years to turn this team around when he first got here. He needed immediate results.

Going on year 5 and fans still want a Stamkos without bottoming out. It just doesn't work out that way.

Tampa's won a cup before the Leafs have in the past 10 years and it wasn't because they were at the top or middle of the standings when they first came in.

They still managed to get Stamkos after winning that cup and we have Tyler Bozak. GO LEAFS GO!!

Clearly we are at an impasse. You also didn't answer the question: how does the way I cheer for my team impact you or the way the team is run? I want the Leafs to win a Cup and I see absolutely no correlation between cheering for them to make it in last year and not wanting them to be long term contenders.

Its funny because I feel like you have this fatalistic view on our team like no players that we have at present have capacity for improvement. Yes, maybe a proper rebuild would be better. But we have guys like Joe Colborne, Jake Gardiner, Carter Ashton etc. now and I see no reason not to cheer them on.  What's done is done.

Do I want the team to tank this year? Admittedly, yes. Will I actually ROOT for them to lose? No, and again, I dont see why youve taken it upon yourself to judge fans like myself because our views differ. We can debate viewpoints all we want, but to me your jumping to conclusions on "types of fans" is a bit unsettling, especially when my opinion of the team has no real impact at all.

 

[Wendel's Fist]

The sad reality with the Leafs is, we're not going to be winning a cup within the next 10 years.....minimum.

There are teams that are ahead of us on the NHL and AHL levels at the same time so how in the hell are we going to beat them anytime soon?

Phil Kessel and Joe Colborne were expendable in Boston and the Bruins still won the cup. Boston has Tyler Seguin to build around when their team slows down due to age. We are building our team around Kessel and hoping that Colborne might be a second line center someday. It's kind of pathetic when we couldn't win one game against Boston this year. Never mind playoff pressure.

Edmonton's team will kick the youth out of our team in a couple of years too. They actually have a first line in the making.

Unless the Leafs tank for this and a couple more years, I just don't see how we're ever going to win a cup.

It's nice that Burke isn't interested in draft picks because he doesn't want to wait. So........what else are we doing right now other than waiting Burkie?

Get that team fired up to win so we can look back on those March/April wins forever as the best days of our lives.

The anti-tank nation must be beaming with pride for all those useless end of the year wins from the past 7 years. Those wins really did carry through to the next season. Do they do anything for you now?

At this point, I'd have no shame in the Leafs dressing up anybody off the street to finish off the season and claiming that the rest of the team had the flu.

Just to be fair, I think it was perfectly fine to be excited about last year's team with a goaltender playing like James did for as long as he did and hope to get in. I honestly don't see anything wrong with that.

It's pretty funny though, it's as if people's views on the team aren't nuanced to some extent. Believe it or not it's not all YAY BURKE, and BURKE'S A DOUCHE. I wanted them to tank in 2008 and 2009 in order to get better picks.

At the same time I don't think you can really chastise people for wanting the team to be a success. It's not like their views make a difference in how the team is run one way or another. I happen to be a little less bleak in my outlook on the team in general, but I don't really see why you should have an issue with that.

It was perfectly fine to hope for the playoffs last year, if you didn't want the Leafs to ever win a cup.

Again, I don't get how that helped us now. Were we much better this year because of it?

Burke himself said that he doesn't just want to get into the playoffs and get knocked out right away. So.......what are we doing because if we get in, we're not going anywhere.

We can't even get into the playoffs and pretending like you can band-aid a team to a Stanley Cup is delusional.

Good thing Burke wasn't interested in waiting 5 years to turn this team around when he first got here. He needed immediate results.

Going on year 5 and fans still want a Stamkos without bottoming out. It just doesn't work out that way.

Tampa's won a cup before the Leafs have in the past 10 years and it wasn't because they were at the top or middle of the standings when they first came in.

They still managed to get Stamkos after winning that cup and we have Tyler Bozak. GO LEAFS GO!!

Clearly we are at an impasse. You also didn't answer the question: how does the way I cheer for my team impact you or the way the team is run? I want the Leafs to win a Cup and I see absolutely no correlation between cheering for them to make it in last year and not wanting them to be long term contenders.

Its funny because I feel like you have this fatalistic view on our team like no players that we have at present have capacity for improvement. Yes, maybe a proper rebuild would be better. But we have guys like Joe Colborne, Jake Gardiner, Carter Ashton etc. now and I see no reason not to cheer them on.  What's done is done.

Do I want the team to tank this year? Admittedly, yes. Will I actually ROOT for them to lose? No, and again, I dont see why youve taken it upon yourself to judge fans like myself because our views differ. We can debate viewpoints all we want, but to me your jumping to conclusions on "types of fans" is a bit unsettling, especially when my opinion of the team has no real impact at all.

You never posed a question in your post. Do you see a question mark at the end of anything you said?? I don't.

How am I supposed to answer a question that you didn't ask??

We're at an impasse with reality, Bender. We either bottom out and get players like Crosby, Stamkos, Hall........or we try to make the playoffs year after year and get whatever we can.

All those towns went through worse times than we have and they're better off now. We've never been at the basement. (except for when we did all we could for Boston to get Seguin)

I don't know how old you are but there was a time when Detroit was the worst team in the league for a very long time. It was almost a joke to have the Leafs play them.

That's why they're so good now.

To answer the question that you never asked............cheer the team all you want. I'm just tired of the same old.

You didn't answer my question..............how are we going to beat Tampa with Stamkos as their building block....never mind Crosby being all of 24 years old and Malkin as his sidekick who's 25?

At what time are we going to beat them with what we have with just hanging on every year and hoping for a playoff birth?

Nazem Kadri, Joe Colborne and Matt Frattin??? Seriously?

 

[losveratos]

There have been very few recent examples of building a winning team through having the best player in the league. Mainly in the last decade or so the only team to have the best offensive forward and win the stanley cup was Malkin in Pitts. Other than that it just doesn't seem to happen on any level consistently to have people constantly make this claim.

There's almost 2 dozen people on the ice during a given night. It's a team sport. Get over this argument really. I'll believe you when the Oilers win the Stanley. But I just don't see it happening anytime soon.

 

[Kin]

There have been very few recent examples of building a winning team through having the best player in the league. Mainly in the last decade or so the only team to have the best offensive forward and win the stanley cup was Malkin in Pitts. Other than that it just doesn't seem to happen on any level consistently to have people constantly make this claim.

A) That's not true. Tampa in '04 also won the cup in a year where they had the Art Ross winner
B) Are you really hearing people constantly claiming that in order to win a Stanley Cup, you need to have the Art Ross winner on the team?

 

[Kin]

I don't know how old you are but there was a time when Detroit was the worst team in the league for a very long time. It was almost a joke to have the Leafs play them.

That's why they're so good now.

It's probably not right to say that the reason the Wings are good right now is because of high draft picks. For the most part their roster is built out of guys drafted in lower rounds.

Drafting high, getting Yzerman and Primeau, was a big part of how they became a good team but the way they jumped into the international market before other teams is just as big a factor. Their scouting and development play a huge role as well.

I'm not disagreeing exactly as I agree that the sort of talent you need to build around tends to come from the top of the draft but the Red Wings aren't really the best way to make that case.

 

[Wendel's Fist]

I don't know how old you are but there was a time when Detroit was the worst team in the league for a very long time. It was almost a joke to have the Leafs play them.

That's why they're so good now.

It's probably not right to say that the reason the Wings are good right now is because of high draft picks. For the most part their roster is built out of guys drafted in lower rounds.

Drafting high, getting Yzerman and Primeau, was a big part of how they became a good team but the way they jumped into the international market before other teams is just as big a factor. Their scouting and development play a huge role as well.

I'm not disagreeing exactly as I agree that the sort of talent you need to build around tends to come from the top of the draft but the Red Wings aren't really the best way to make that case.

You're right, I think the Red Wings' European scout is one of the highest paid in the league and for good reason.

I probably should have said that the team's bottoming out was the reason they won a cup or two in the first place. They've stayed on top since then because they're brilliant and to be fair, a bit lucky.

 

[Wendel's Fist]

There have been very few recent examples of building a winning team through having the best player in the league. Mainly in the last decade or so the only team to have the best offensive forward and win the stanley cup was Malkin in Pitts. Other than that it just doesn't seem to happen on any level consistently to have people constantly make this claim.

There's almost 2 dozen people on the ice during a given night. It's a team sport. Get over this argument really. I'll believe you when the Oilers win the Stanley. But I just don't see it happening anytime soon.

I'd prefer Edmonton's team for the future over our's.

Look what we'd have to trade to get a guy like Rick Nash. Edmonton might get a draft pick back if they gave Columbus Taylor Hall.

 

[Kaberle15]

Magic Numbers: 6 points out of the race, 4 points ahead of a top 3 pick! (with the 8th overall before the future loss @ washington later today).

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

I probably should have said that the team's bottoming out was the reason they won a cup or two in the first place.

Doesn't really seem like that.  Yzerman, of course, was a 4th overall pick, but he's not the sole reason they won a Cup, and he was drafted way back in 1983.

Of the key guys who they drafted who were on those first Cup teams: Lidstrom was a 3rd rounder, Fedorov was a 4th rounder, Kozlov was a 3rd rounder, Osgood was a 3rd rounder. 

I guess their draft position would have some sort of bearing on where in those rounds those guys would get drafted, but it doesn't appear to be a team built out of bottoming out in the draft.  However, I can't speak as to whether any of their other 1st round picks were used in trades to get other players.

EDIT: Forgot Keith Primeau!  Can't believe he was 3rd overall, and forgot he was on the Wings until '96.

 

[Bender]

The sad reality with the Leafs is, we're not going to be winning a cup within the next 10 years.....minimum.

There are teams that are ahead of us on the NHL and AHL levels at the same time so how in the hell are we going to beat them anytime soon?

Phil Kessel and Joe Colborne were expendable in Boston and the Bruins still won the cup. Boston has Tyler Seguin to build around when their team slows down due to age. We are building our team around Kessel and hoping that Colborne might be a second line center someday. It's kind of pathetic when we couldn't win one game against Boston this year. Never mind playoff pressure.

Edmonton's team will kick the youth out of our team in a couple of years too. They actually have a first line in the making.

Unless the Leafs tank for this and a couple more years, I just don't see how we're ever going to win a cup.

It's nice that Burke isn't interested in draft picks because he doesn't want to wait. So........what else are we doing right now other than waiting Burkie?

Get that team fired up to win so we can look back on those March/April wins forever as the best days of our lives.

The anti-tank nation must be beaming with pride for all those useless end of the year wins from the past 7 years. Those wins really did carry through to the next season. Do they do anything for you now?

At this point, I'd have no shame in the Leafs dressing up anybody off the street to finish off the season and claiming that the rest of the team had the flu.

Just to be fair, I think it was perfectly fine to be excited about last year's team with a goaltender playing like James did for as long as he did and hope to get in. I honestly don't see anything wrong with that.

It's pretty funny though, it's as if people's views on the team aren't nuanced to some extent. Believe it or not it's not all YAY BURKE, and BURKE'S A DOUCHE. I wanted them to tank in 2008 and 2009 in order to get better picks.

At the same time I don't think you can really chastise people for wanting the team to be a success. It's not like their views make a difference in how the team is run one way or another. I happen to be a little less bleak in my outlook on the team in general, but I don't really see why you should have an issue with that.

It was perfectly fine to hope for the playoffs last year, if you didn't want the Leafs to ever win a cup.

Again, I don't get how that helped us now. Were we much better this year because of it?

Burke himself said that he doesn't just want to get into the playoffs and get knocked out right away. So.......what are we doing because if we get in, we're not going anywhere.

We can't even get into the playoffs and pretending like you can band-aid a team to a Stanley Cup is delusional.

Good thing Burke wasn't interested in waiting 5 years to turn this team around when he first got here. He needed immediate results.

Going on year 5 and fans still want a Stamkos without bottoming out. It just doesn't work out that way.

Tampa's won a cup before the Leafs have in the past 10 years and it wasn't because they were at the top or middle of the standings when they first came in.

They still managed to get Stamkos after winning that cup and we have Tyler Bozak. GO LEAFS GO!!

Clearly we are at an impasse. You also didn't answer the question: how does the way I cheer for my team impact you or the way the team is run? I want the Leafs to win a Cup and I see absolutely no correlation between cheering for them to make it in last year and not wanting them to be long term contenders.

Its funny because I feel like you have this fatalistic view on our team like no players that we have at present have capacity for improvement. Yes, maybe a proper rebuild would be better. But we have guys like Joe Colborne, Jake Gardiner, Carter Ashton etc. now and I see no reason not to cheer them on.  What's done is done.

Do I want the team to tank this year? Admittedly, yes. Will I actually ROOT for them to lose? No, and again, I dont see why youve taken it upon yourself to judge fans like myself because our views differ. We can debate viewpoints all we want, but to me your jumping to conclusions on "types of fans" is a bit unsettling, especially when my opinion of the team has no real impact at all.

You never posed a question in your post. Do you see a question mark at the end of anything you said?? I don't.

How am I supposed to answer a question that you didn't ask??

We're at an impasse with reality, Bender. We either bottom out and get players like Crosby, Stamkos, Hall........or we try to make the playoffs year after year and get whatever we can.

All those towns went through worse times than we have and they're better off now. We've never been at the basement. (except for when we did all we could for Boston to get Seguin)

I don't know how old you are but there was a time when Detroit was the worst team in the league for a very long time. It was almost a joke to have the Leafs play them.

That's why they're so good now.

To answer the question that you never asked............cheer the team all you want. I'm just tired of the same old.

You didn't answer my question..............how are we going to beat Tampa with Stamkos as their building block....never mind Crosby being all of 24 years old and Malkin as his sidekick who's 25?

At what time are we going to beat them with what we have with just hanging on every year and hoping for a playoff birth?

Nazem Kadri, Joe Colborne and Matt Frattin??? Seriously?

Ok how about this: you made no counterpoint to it, when it was clearly something we were debating. I also clearly asked the question in the second post but you seem to have skirted around the issue.

Youre making judgments on fans based on the way they cheer for the team. I don't think it really makes a difference one way or another if they cheer for the playoffs or cheer for a tank for a bunch of years, management will run the team the way they see fit.

And for the record I have no idea what you're arguing against because I am in favour of a rebuild. But at the same time there are examples that don't fit your mold. The St. Louis Blues - one of the best teams in the NHL right now - didn't draft a boat load of their players. Detroit hasn't tanked in almost 20 years (didn't need to tank to get Lidstrom), Boston hasn't REALLY tanked. Yeah they're better set up for the future but they didn't win BECAUSE of Seguin. The cornerstone of that team is Chara - a ufa - and I would argue that the team wasn't ready to compete when they brought him in. Their tanking early on in the decade didn't really impact them, they made shrewd moves and their prospects like Marchand, Krejci and Bergeron (none of which who were picked in the first round) really developed.

Scoff as much as you want at our prospects but I see no reason to not hope that players like Kadri, Colborne, Frattin etc al. develop into legitimate hockey players like those three in Boston.

So you can bitch until you have one foot in the grave, personally I'll cheer for my team, even during rough seasons knowing that a team I cheered for didn't cause any undue suffering like it seems to have caused in a few others.

 

[Bates]

I am not so sure this tank thing will work out as well for Edmonton either.  In the next few years they will have to resign all these first overall draft picks to their second contracts and I doubt that will leave much money for the rest of the roster.