Randy Carlyle/Leaf Coach thread

[Zee]

It's funny that none of these blogs were written, nor were the complaints as rampant when the Leafs were winning. Such a fickle bunch.

Is that really odd or contradictory though? I was under the impression that being sports fan was largely predicated on cheering a team when they won and complaining about them when they lost.

I'm amazed at how quickly i've soured on Carlyle.  Although I was never on board to start with, I was in the Eakins-deserved-a-shot camp, but while the Leafs were winning I was ok with Carlyle.  Now with the losses mounting I'm questioning his player selection, d-combinations and ice time for certain players.  I can't help but think the Leafs will be regretting Eakins walking in the summer for years to come.

 

[Deebo]

I've never seen so much angst over the possibility of losing an AHL coach.

 

[losveratos]

I've never seen so much angst over the possibility of losing an AHL coach.

But he's our AHL coach! Makes a world of difference 

 

[Zee]

I've never seen so much angst over the possibility of losing an AHL coach.

All coaches start somewhere, and he's proving he can work with and develop young players, exactly what the Leafs have right now.  Is it crazy to want a current AHL coach over a Stanley Cup winning coach?  Maybe it is, I guess we'll find out when Eakins gets his shot at the NHL level.

 

[Peter D.]

I didn't want to derail the Steckel thread, but I want to follow up on the point that many of us are in agreement on in that Steckel was viewed as redundant because of McClement, yet we'd still rather have him in the lineup than both McLaren and Orr.

Which got me forward thinking -- if the Leafs do indeed make the playoffs, there can't be any way possible Carlyle has both McLaren and Orr in the lineup.  Can he?  That'd be sheer stupidity.

 

[Zee]

I didn't want to derail the Steckel thread, but I want to follow up on the point that many of us are in agreement on in that Steckel was viewed as redundant because of McClement, yet we'd still rather have him in the lineup than both McLaren and Orr.

Which got me forward thinking -- if the Leafs do indeed make the playoffs, there can't be any way possible Carlyle has both McLaren and Orr in the lineup.  Can he?  That'd be sheer stupidity.

The way things are unfolding, I don't think we'll have to worry about that scenario.

 

[Deebo]

Which got me forward thinking -- if the Leafs do indeed make the playoffs, there can't be any way possible Carlyle has both McLaren and Orr in the lineup.  Can he?  That'd be sheer stupidity.

Kessel,Lupul,Bozak,JVR,Kadri,Frattin,MacArthur,Grabovski,Kulemin,Komarov,McClement,Orr

I don't think both get into the line-up tomorrow.

 

[Zee]

Which got me forward thinking -- if the Leafs do indeed make the playoffs, there can't be any way possible Carlyle has both McLaren and Orr in the lineup.  Can he?  That'd be sheer stupidity.

Kessel,Lupul,Bozak,JVR,Kadri,Frattin,MacArthur,Grabovski,Kulemin,Komarov,McClement,Orr

I don't think both get into the line-up tomorrow.

If someone OTHER than McLaren or Orr come out of tomorrow's lineup, Carlyle has officially lost his mind.

 

[Frank E]

I didn't want to derail the Steckel thread, but I want to follow up on the point that many of us are in agreement on in that Steckel was viewed as redundant because of McClement, yet we'd still rather have him in the lineup than both McLaren and Orr.

Which got me forward thinking -- if the Leafs do indeed make the playoffs, there can't be any way possible Carlyle has both McLaren and Orr in the lineup.  Can he?  That'd be sheer stupidity.

For all the "stupidity" talk, Orr's a +1 and McLaren a -1.

It's not like they're killing the team at all.

If teams were filling the net with those guys on the ice, I could better understand the ire.  They play like 5-6 minutes a game.

The Leafs are finally a more truculent team, and have had some reasonably surprising success with it.

 

[Corn Flake]

Which got me forward thinking -- if the Leafs do indeed make the playoffs, there can't be any way possible Carlyle has both McLaren and Orr in the lineup.  Can he?  That'd be sheer stupidity.

He didn't dress Parros much in the playoffs in the Ducks cup run, so there is some history saying he probably won't here either.

 

[drummond]

Which got me forward thinking -- if the Leafs do indeed make the playoffs, there can't be any way possible Carlyle has both McLaren and Orr in the lineup.  Can he?  That'd be sheer stupidity.

Kessel,Lupul,Bozak,JVR,Kadri,Frattin,MacArthur,Grabovski,Kulemin,Komarov,McClement,Orr

I don't think both get into the line-up tomorrow.

If someone OTHER than McLaren or Orr come out of tomorrow's lineup, Carlyle has officially lost his mind.

I am afraid he may sit either Komarov, or in an attempt to send a message Kuli or Grabbo.

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

I didn't want to derail the Steckel thread, but I want to follow up on the point that many of us are in agreement on in that Steckel was viewed as redundant because of McClement, yet we'd still rather have him in the lineup than both McLaren and Orr.

Which got me forward thinking -- if the Leafs do indeed make the playoffs, there can't be any way possible Carlyle has both McLaren and Orr in the lineup.  Can he?  That'd be sheer stupidity.

For all the "stupidity" talk, Orr's a +1 and McLaren a -1.

It's not like they're killing the team at all.

If teams were filling the net with those guys on the ice, I could better understand the ire.  They play like 5-6 minutes a game.

The Leafs are finally a more truculent team, and have had some reasonably surprising success with it.

Because they have to be given easy minutes, whereas if you had a 4th line that could play you wouldn't need to start McLaren 60% of the time in the offensive zone, and could give those minutes to an offensive line instead.  They're not necessarily killing the team, they're just taking up space and not doing much positive with it.

 

[Zee]

I didn't want to derail the Steckel thread, but I want to follow up on the point that many of us are in agreement on in that Steckel was viewed as redundant because of McClement, yet we'd still rather have him in the lineup than both McLaren and Orr.

Which got me forward thinking -- if the Leafs do indeed make the playoffs, there can't be any way possible Carlyle has both McLaren and Orr in the lineup.  Can he?  That'd be sheer stupidity.

For all the "stupidity" talk, Orr's a +1 and McLaren a -1.

It's not like they're killing the team at all.

If teams were filling the net with those guys on the ice, I could better understand the ire.  They play like 5-6 minutes a game.

The Leafs are finally a more truculent team, and have had some reasonably surprising success with it.

I'm always on the side of dressing players that can actually play.  Orr and McLaren each played 2 minutes against the Pens last night, basically Carlyle could have just left 2 open roster spots for the game and it wouldn't have made a lick of difference.  Now against a team like the Pens, or any skilled team, what exactly are they used for?  What if God forbid you have an injury to a forward in the first period and suddenly those 2 guys need to step up their minutes?  I'd rather have guys on the 4th line that can actually contribute something to the outcome other than fighting.

 

[Deebo]

I didn't want to derail the Steckel thread, but I want to follow up on the point that many of us are in agreement on in that Steckel was viewed as redundant because of McClement, yet we'd still rather have him in the lineup than both McLaren and Orr.

Which got me forward thinking -- if the Leafs do indeed make the playoffs, there can't be any way possible Carlyle has both McLaren and Orr in the lineup.  Can he?  That'd be sheer stupidity.

For all the "stupidity" talk, Orr's a +1 and McLaren a -1.

It's not like they're killing the team at all.

If teams were filling the net with those guys on the ice, I could better understand the ire.  They play like 5-6 minutes a game.

The Leafs are finally a more truculent team, and have had some reasonably surprising success with it.

I read McLaren only has 2 minor penalties this season and 1 came in the final 30s of the 5-2 loss to Winnipeg.

 

[BlueWhiteBlood]

I am afraid he may sit either Komarov, or in an attempt to send a message Kuli or Grabbo.

Not the way he was using Komarov last night, the guy seemed to be double shifting all night long. I think he's the coaches pet, so to speak.

 

[Deebo]

I am afraid he may sit either Komarov, or in an attempt to send a message Kuli or Grabbo.

Not the way he was using Komarov last night, the guy seemed to be double shifting all night long. I think he's the coaches pet, so to speak.

He did sit Kostka after he was 2nd in ATOI among the defense.

 

[Kin]

I didn't want to derail the Steckel thread, but I want to follow up on the point that many of us are in agreement on in that Steckel was viewed as redundant because of McClement, yet we'd still rather have him in the lineup than both McLaren and Orr.

is

I don't buy the idea that McClement makes Steckel redundant. To me they fill fairly different roles. McClement isn't a 4th liner who should get 8 minutes a night. He should be on a second or third line or whatever line a team is using to check the opposition's best line.

Steckel on the other hand is a 4th line guy. Maybe he gets some PK time if you're desperate but he's really more of a semi-useful guy who isn't a defensive liability and who will acquit himself relatively well when all the other lines are gassed.

 

[BlueWhiteBlood]

I am afraid he may sit either Komarov, or in an attempt to send a message Kuli or Grabbo.

Not the way he was using Komarov last night, the guy seemed to be double shifting all night long. I think he's the coaches pet, so to speak.

He did sit Kostka after he was 2nd in ATOI among the defense.

It's not out of the realm of possibility, but I get the feeling that as long as Komarov hits everything that moves and forechecks like a beast,  he won't come out of the line up.

 

[Corn Flake]

I am afraid he may sit either Komarov, or in an attempt to send a message Kuli or Grabbo.

If he's trying to send that kind of message, sit Kuli.

 

[drummond]

I am afraid he may sit either Komarov, or in an attempt to send a message Kuli or Grabbo.

If he's trying to send that kind of message, sit Kuli.

And how about giving Grabbo, Kuli some quality PP time? Wouldn?t that be better to get them going? They scored as many ES goals as Bozak/JVR/Kessel line, the only difference between our No1 line and No2 line is that No1 gets PP time and points from there whereas No2 line does not, which is not their fault as they get minimum minutes there. Simple as that. Funny he has this as he calls it "cookies" (PP time as a reward) for Orr, but not for Kuli. It is really difficult to comprehend. Grabbo/Kuli have the league most defensive zone starts - if I am not mistaken both are above 65% - usually against the best opposition, this is not exactelly the position to socre plenty of goals.

I really do not get what Carlyle really wants from Grabbo and Kuli. A true 2-way centre such as Bergeron? Great. Giving him slightly less than 50% offensive zone starts? Sure. At about 40% would be tough, but Grabbo and Kuli could handle that IMO. But less than 35%? That is crazy. Scoring when starting 65% to 70% of your starts in your own zone is really, really tough. This is a waste of a 5.5 million dollar player doing that? other coaches employ a pure checking line unit - for example an actual 4th line and not 2:40min icetime fighters/clowns.

Naturally Kulemin falls into the same category. Just recall how many goals and PP goals he scored for Paul Maurice in Magnitogorsk just few month ago. Sure he played with Datsyuk and Mozyakin, but he certainly can execute a PP.

http://www.pensionplanpuppets.com/2013/3/13/4098494/re-visiting-randys-remarks-grabovski-and-kulemin