Something to keep in mind for the upcoming season

[Puerto Rico Suave]

My excitement is tempered going into this season and I nearly forgot the first game was tonight until a coworker mentioned it just now.  It's not because I'm worn out on the team or dreading the road ahead though: it's because the Blue Jays are in the playoffs and are a legit contender for the World Series.  I only got so much emotion to invest at one time!

 

[Bill_Berg]

Hate the game not the player.

Yes. That's what I'm doing. I'm saying the system is fundamentally flawed by rewarding bad behaviour.

Should the Leafs tank, draft 1st overall 4 times in a row, then win a Cup some time after that, that Cup win isn't tainted by unsportsmanlike conduct.

I mean, it's not uniquely tainted by unsportsmanlike conduct but it very much is the result of it all the same.

Regardless, the key point there is it's not really an accomplishment either. Failing upwards isn't a cause for celebration.

I will celebrate the end result, less so the process. Totally agree that the system is flawed.

 

[Redleaf]

The way I'm dealing with the Leafs now is twofold..

1) cheer for them to win every game (otherwise what's the point of watching really)

2) be satisfied with losses because we know that is what we really need to continue to build this club properly

When people (who know I'm a fan) tell me the Leafs suck nowadays, I say ,"it's true and I'm really happy about that."  I get some confused looks, but it makes me smile.

 

[TML fan]

Did Shanahan actually say that quote? Because it doesn't make any sense. A ship with a hole in the bottom will sink regardless of what direction it's going.

Go Leafs Go.

 

[pnjunction]

I've also been big on the tank since the 9th place years...agree now that it's happening it's still sad and frustrating and I'll probably watch even less than when they were pointlessly gunning for 8th spot and an early playoff exit.

Randomly drawing ALL non-playoff team picks with even odds would solve this issue, but of course this change right now would be horrible timing for the Leafs... You could get things Boston and LA getting McDavid and Eichel but that would be the breaks of not rewarding losing.

Bringing money and cap space into it is an interesting idea, I haven't thought about it.

 

[rdowdall]

I've been frustrated to the point of walking away over the last 10 years.  It's not the losing as so much as it is the stupid decisions that resulted in the losing.  It's gotten to the point where one Travis Zajac trade could dispel all of the optimism that I have.

All I want is a smart and competent front office.  If you start there and build on that, you should get a winning team eventually.  It has been hard for the Leafs to build that though.

It does seem different though.  Fans who hate the Leafs are chuckling at the losses, but it seems like it's a nervous laughter now.

 

[Kin]

Randomly drawing ALL non-playoff team picks with even odds would solve this issue, but of course this change right now would be horrible timing for the Leafs... You could get things Boston and LA getting McDavid and Eichel but that would be the breaks of not rewarding losing.

It solves the problem of rewarding failure, I suppose, but you don't want to create a situation where in a Connor McDavid sort of draft year you could credibly argue that you'd rather finish 9th than 8th.

But also, while random chance is probably better than rewarding ineptitude, I don't think it's really a solution. You want to give smart, well-managed teams a path towards building back up that isn't about crossing your fingers and hoping for the best.

 

[brothert]

Why can't the draft just be a systematic thing.  Sort them alphabetically at first, then follow a 30 year preset pattern.

The first team alphabetically follows the 30 year pattern as follows...
1st, 30th, 2nd, 29th, 3rd, 28th ......

Then at the draft follow a snaking pattern 1,60,61,120,121,180,181.

 

[Kin]

Why can't the draft just be a systematic thing.  Sort them alphabetically at first, then follow a 30 year preset pattern.

The first team alphabetically follows the 30 year pattern as follows...
1st, 30th, 2nd, 29th, 3rd, 28th ......

Then at the draft follow a snaking pattern 1,60,61,120,121,180,181.

I mean, it could, but then it just shifts the burden of randomness onto who's lucky enough to be drafting high in good draft years vs. bad ones.

I still think what you ideally want is to give teams an avenue to get better just not one that provides serious incentive to fail.

 

[brothert]

Why can't the draft just be a systematic thing.  Sort them alphabetically at first, then follow a 30 year preset pattern.

The first team alphabetically follows the 30 year pattern as follows...
1st, 30th, 2nd, 29th, 3rd, 28th ......

Then at the draft follow a snaking pattern 1,60,61,120,121,180,181.

I mean, it could, but then it just shifts the burden of randomness onto who's lucky enough to be drafting high in good draft years vs. bad ones.

I still think what you ideally want is to give teams an avenue to get better just not one that provides serious incentive to fail.

But good draft years and bad draft years will all be about luck regardless.  What it would take away is that ability of teams to ensure they are last when they know it's a good draft year a la quebec and the lindros draft.  Look at Edmonton.  We are letting them draft their way out of incompetence.  How many chances at the golden ticket do they get to have???  They've had more 1st overalls than an average team gets in a hundred years.  Where is the sense in that.

 

[Kin]

But good draft years and bad draft years will all be about luck regardless.  What it would take away is that ability of teams to ensure they are last when they know it's a good draft year a la quebec and the lindros draft.  Look at Edmonton.  We are letting them draft their way out of incompetence.  How many chances at the golden ticket do they get to have???  They've had more 1st overalls than an average team gets in a hundred years.  Where is the sense in that.

I agree in principal, I just don't think a team or it's fanbase should be punished for a long amount of time because of a terrible front office. In your scenario each team would have a 10 year stretch where they'd pick no higher than #11th and no lower than #20. If you're a fan of a team that's legitimately bad because of a bad GM and you fire that GM but you're in that 10 year stretch, there's essentially no good way to rebuild.

Right now I'm saying there's not enough skill in the process. What you're advocating essentially removes skill from the equation completely.