The Official Complaint Thread!

[WhatIfGodWasALeaf]

My friend Jenn is a ginger.  <----- not particularly offensive. Just stating she's a red head really.

Again, I don't agree with that.

Then you're in the minority here so to speak, your perception of the word is warped, not everyone else.

 

[bustaheims]

Then you're in the minority here so to speak, your perception of the word is warped, not everyone else.

Yeah. All the redheads I know in real life have no issue with being called gingers by gingers and non-gingers alike. I think most of them would be downright confused at your level of offence towards the term, Sarge.

 

[Bullfrog]

My friend Jenn is a ginger.  <----- not particularly offensive. Just stating she's a red head really.
Gingers have fiery tempers.  <----- discriminatory.

Not that it matters and while that's somewhat technically correct I think it's probably better to use the second as an example of a stereotyping or prejudice. I think discriminatory or discrimination is a word probably better left to actions reflecting prejudice.

I stand by my use of the word, but I'll rephrase it as such:
"Gingers have fiery tempers, so I refuse to serve them."

;D You're probably right though.

 

[Kin]

Again, I don't agree with that.

Which is fine. Nobody is going to tell you you can't take offense to whatever you please. At issue is you trying to push your interpretation of that word onto other people.

Just as an example, one of my grandmothers is half-Romany and, as a result, I was taught growing up that "to gyp" someone or even using "Gypsy" to refer to the Romany people was an ethnic slur on par with using the N-word. Now, the thing there is, that's true. And, as per what I was saying above, the Romany actually have been discriminated against in the worst of possible ways throughout history.

But you do a search on this website and people use Gypsy and even Gypped pretty casually. I'd have a much better leg to stand on to object to that but even then, the reality is that most people don't see them as offensive terms.

 

[Bullfrog]

With that particular example Nik, I think a lot has to do with ignorance. I honestly hadn't realized that's where the term "to gyp" came from.

edit: could just be ignorance on my part.

 

[Deebo]

I too find it similar, just thinking back to all those redheads who were taken from their homeland and enslaved.

Well, that might be the dumbest post I've read in a very long while, Potvin. You obviously have no idea what red headed children go through in school. It's pretty much EXACTLY like what other kids who look "different" go through.

Edit: It's a derogatory term aimed to hurt. As a red head, I find it's use rather disgusting.

You really find it that offensive?

I'm a redhead too, and I didn't like the jokes as a kid either but whatever.. everyone got it for something as a kid and that's about the worst of it for me.  Nobody really ever calls me a ginger but if they do it's more just kind of dumb than offensive to me.  I really don't consider it anywhere close to the "N" word level of derogatory word.

I do... I find this whole "ginger" thing disgusting. I think the people who use the word now are of like minds with people who might have found the "N" word acceptable 40 years ago. Further to Potvin's post (or at least my reply to it) Pakistanis (and Indians for that matter) who get called the "P" word would also find that word as offensive as the "N" word too but they weren't brought from Africa and enslaved in American plantations either so you know, a rather silly thing of him to say I think.

I am of South Asian descent and I honestly don't think the P word is as bad as the N word.

 

[Kin]

With that particular example Nik, I think a lot has to do with ignorance. I honestly hadn't realized that's where the term "to gyp" came from.

Sure and something I've learned is that my Grandmother's view on the term isn't universal either. Some Romany call themselves Gypsies proudly.

So, you know, to some extent you've got to be able to show flex.

 

[maplesyrup]

Then you're in the minority here so to speak, your perception of the word is warped, not everyone else.

Yeah. All the redheads I know in real life have no issue with being called gingers by gingers and non-gingers alike. I think most of them would be downright confused at your level of offence towards the term, Sarge.

Well, I think there's a pretty good reason why it's not allowed to be said at my kid's school. Honestly, I think I might be the only sane person here on this particular issue. 

 

[Kin]

Well, I think there's a pretty good reason why it's not allowed to be said at my kid's school.

I'd hope that your kid's school would not allow teasing or name-calling to any degree. Because if teachers are saying "Oh, you're making fun of that kid? Why? Because he's wearing crappy sneakers? Right on, just don't throw a Ginger in there" then it probably says something worse about the school.

Honestly, I think I might be the only sane person here on this particular issue.

Yeah, all of our personal experiences, well reasoned arguments and linguistic positions are KA-WAZEE!

 

[bustaheims]

Well, I think there's a pretty good reason why it's not allowed to be said at my kid's school. Honestly, I think I might be the only sane person here on this particular issue.

Yeah, because it's a bullying issue, but that has very little to do with the word/term itself and just about everything to do with the would-be bullies.

 

[Tigger]

Then you're in the minority here so to speak, your perception of the word is warped, not everyone else.

Yeah. All the redheads I know in real life have no issue with being called gingers by gingers and non-gingers alike. I think most of them would be downright confused at your level of offence towards the term, Sarge.

Well, I think there's a pretty good reason why it's not allowed to be said at my kid's school. Honestly, I think I might be the only sane person here on this particular issue. 

Are you calling everyone crazy? Part of the meaning of the word ginger includes light reddish yellow, it's pretty benign.

I suppose if I was a kid in your class and I screamed 'Caucasian' at someone enough times that would become a banned word too? Or is that more about bullying than anything else?

 

[maplesyrup]

Well, I think there's a pretty good reason why it's not allowed to be said at my kid's school. Honestly, I think I might be the only sane person here on this particular issue.

Yeah, because it's a bullying issue, but that has very little to do with the word/term itself and just about everything to do with the would-be bullies.

In fact, it's quite a large bullying issue and has as much to do with the word than the bullies themselves. The principle would have a hard time suspending a child on the basis of calling a red-head a "red-head." I mean, explain that to the parents. 

 

[maplesyrup]

Are you calling everyone crazy? Part of the meaning of the word ginger includes light reddish yellow, it's pretty benign.

I suppose if I was a kid in your class and I screamed 'Caucasian' at someone enough times that would become a banned word too? Or is that more about bullying than anything else?

No, just the people that don't get it. "Auburn" is nice way of saying "red-head." "Ginger" isn't. - There are no "kick a auburn" or kick a red-head days." There is a specific reason why bullies choose to use the word "ginger."   

 

[bustaheims]

In fact, it's quite a large bullying issue and has as much to do with the word than the bullies themselves. The principle would have a hard time suspending a child on the basis of calling a red-head a "red-head." I mean, explain that to the parents.

But, again, that's not about the word, that's about the action. If some kid was pushing another around constantly calling him "red" or "redhead" or whatever, that kid would be suspended. The word being used, in this case, is largely immaterial. If a kid is going to bully someone because of the colour of their hair, they're going to do so regardless of what words they can or cannot use.

 

[maplesyrup]

But, again, that's not about the word, that's about the action. If some kid was pushing another around constantly calling him "red" or "redhead" or whatever, that kid would be suspended. The word being used, in this case, is largely immaterial. If a kid is going to bully someone because of the colour of their hair, they're going to do so regardless of what words they can or cannot use.

No. No pushing around needed. No physicality at all required. Just the word alone said to or about a red-head is a trip to the principle's office. So, again, it's about the word.

 

[Kin]

The principle would have a hard time suspending a child on the basis of calling a red-head a "red-head." I mean, explain that to the parents.

I don't see how any decent principal would have a hard time explaining a suspension for bullying regardless of the words being used. Conversely, if a principal suspended a kid for using the word ginger without malice I'd have just as much of a problem with it as with red-head.

 

[bustaheims]

No. No pushing around needed. No physicality at all required. Just the word alone said to or about a red-head is a trip to the principle's office. So, again, it's about the word.

The rule is about the word, but the reasoning for the rule has little to nothing to do with it. In fact, I'd say banning the word is a misplaced reaction to the situation - they were attempting to deal with bullying, but, instead, ignored the actions and/or motivations of the bully and put all their emphasis on the word. My guess is this rule made little to no impact on the situation they were trying to deal with, because it doesn't deal with the bullying at all.

 

[maplesyrup]

Conversely, if a principal suspended a kid for using the word ginger without malice I'd have just as much of a problem with it as with red-head.

And much to my original point, I suspect a lot of people would have the same issue 40 or more years ago with the use of the "N" word or similar slurs.

 

[Tigger]

Are you calling everyone crazy? Part of the meaning of the word ginger includes light reddish yellow, it's pretty benign.

I suppose if I was a kid in your class and I screamed 'Caucasian' at someone enough times that would become a banned word too? Or is that more about bullying than anything else?

No, just the people that don't get it. "Auburn" is nice way of saying "red-head." "Ginger" isn't. - There are no "kick a auburn" or kick a red-head days." There is a specific reason why bullies choose to use the word "ginger."   

Kick a ginger day is more offensive to you than kick a red head day? It's the exact same thing to me.

If I was a kid in that school and could get sent to the office for saying ginger I'd do it every day, just to protest how truly absurd that is, then I'd start screaming about auburn inequality.

 

[hap_leaf]

Yeah, because it's a bullying issue, but that has very little to do with the word/term itself and just about everything to do with the would-be bullies.

That is absurd.  You can't separate the perpatrator and their actions.  They are one in the same.  In this case, using a term to invoke a negative response to gain feelings of superiority over another.  It is irrelevant if you agree that the term has negative connotations.