Tournament Starts Today

[mr grieves]

Eh, you know, I love Phil and think the fact that he's been unfairly dumped on for so much of his career buys him a little leeway but let's be real, if Mark Messier had done the same thing after Nagano or something we'd all have thought it was a jerk move.

Well I'm not entirely sure that's true or if it's even relevant to something happening today, but my main issue with Backes getting upset here is that he's acting like Phil was personally calling out the players on the team. I think it's pretty clear if Phil has an issue with someone it's with someone a lot higher in USA Hockey than David Backes. More from him here too:

Stephen Whyno ‏@SWhyno
Backes said tweets "don?t get lost in the fray and those comments are there and have been read and I think will be remembered."

On the bolded bit, yeah. Some players -- not just those who are disappointed by the loss, but the ex-NHLers I've seen on TV -- seem not to get this. Which is odd. Phil's been pretty blunt in calling bad management before (remember his defense of Phaneuf: "well, he didn't build this team" or something). There's a feeling that it's somehow disrespectful not to pretend a group of professional athletes -- no matter how limited their abilities relative to competition, or how poorly combined -- are not fully in control of their destiny. Maybe some need to believe that to do what they do, but I think it's kind of awesome that Kessel is immune to it.

 

[mr grieves]

If Canada holds on against Europe, then it's Sweden vs. Europe and Canada vs.RUS/TNA in the next round... right?

 

[Kin]

If Canada holds on against Europe, then it's Sweden vs. Europe and Canada vs.RUS/TNA in the next round... right?

Right.

 

[ZBBM]

So now Kessel says his tweet was meant for ... ?

"Of course it wasn't directed at the players," Kessel said in a text to ESPN. "I know how tough it is to play the game. It wasn't directed at anyone."

An incoherent attempt to walk back a semi-coherent trollpost.

I'm about the last person you'd call patriotic, but frankly all these ex-players and not-picked players shooting their mouths off is exactly what Backes said it was.  Everyone knows USA management and Torts botched this.  Peanut gallery social media sarcasm from these guys accomplishes exactly nothing except to call attention to themselves.

 

[Heroic Shrimp]

An OT win still clinched a spot for them, right?

edit: Nevermind, they still need a Russian loss. Go Finland!

So, I may never see Matthews play with McDavid ever again, at any level?  I am NOT okay with that.

 

[mr grieves]

So now Kessel says his tweet was meant for ... ?

"Of course it wasn't directed at the players," Kessel said in a text to ESPN. "I know how tough it is to play the game. It wasn't directed at anyone."

An incoherent attempt to walk back a semi-coherent trollpost.

I'm about the last person you'd call patriotic, but frankly all these ex-players and not-picked players shooting their mouths off is exactly what Backes said it was.  Everyone knows USA management and Torts botched this.  Peanut gallery social media sarcasm from these guys accomplishes exactly nothing except to call attention to themselves.

Themselves? You mean the guys USA should've brought in the first place? Calling attention to the guys over-looked by the management, which was sort of the core of Torts and management's botch job, seems.... I don't know. If diagnosing the disease is step toward a cure, then skill guys being what we're talking about in relation to USA's failure seems sorta like an accomplishment. Sure beats Torts failing to get them to gel and the anthem stuff, anyhow.

 

[Bates]

How about the 2020 World Cup Of Hockey as both will still be with the Young Guns?

An OT win still clinched a spot for them, right?

edit: Nevermind, they still need a Russian loss. Go Finland!

So, I may never see Matthews play with McDavid ever again, at any level?  I am NOT okay with that.

 

[disco]

Yeah, they left scoring off the club and desperately needed it in a tight and short tourney. I think it was just some ribbing to USA brass while watching on helplessly from the couch while the team gets eliminated in two games. Plus the snub was an eyebrow raiser for many, he just led the playoffs in scoring. Not really burning a bridge, if they didn't put him on it now they never will.

 

[bustaheims]

How about the 2020 World Cup Of Hockey as both will still be with the Young Guns?

The plan was for TNA and Team Europe to be put together for this tournament only. If there is a World Cup in 2020, the expectation is that there won't be a 23 and under team.

 

[bustaheims]

So, I may never see Matthews play with McDavid ever again, at any level?  I am NOT okay with that.

Not until McDavid signs with the Leafs as a UFA . . . ;D

 

[CarltonTheBear]

So kind of a weird situation yesterday as apparently nobody told the kids about how the tie-breaker system works. They thought if they won (even in OT), they were in:

?Honestly when I scored, I thought we were in,? said MacKinnon. ?We were talking, maybe we shouldn?t have (celebrated) that hard.?

Except Sportsnet?s Scott Oake told MacKinnon that North America now needed winless Finland to beat Russia Thursday to advance. Johnny Gaudreau, who made the pass to MacKinnon, found out when he returned to the locker room and found downcast faces. The coaches knew what they needed to advance. They just didn?t tell the players.

?We knew that winning would do wonders for us,? said North America coach Todd McLellan. ?We knew that getting into the situation we ended in we would still need help. But as we went down the stretch, we played to win there.?

But they didn?t go after it at all costs, and they should have. After Sweden tied this thrilling, let-them-play-forever hockey game with 13:10 remaining in the third period, nobody was double-shifted. The most dangerous guys ? McDavid, Auston Matthews, Gaudreau, etc. ? weren?t left out there for extra-long shifts at the end. North America played a risk-reward scenario: They would rather try to win playing straight hockey against a Sweden team playing for overtime rather than tell the players, we need this. Go for it.

https://www.thestar.com/sports/hockey/2016/09/21/team-north-america-should-have-been-true-to-itself-against-sweden-arthur.html

 

[herman]

WWBD?

 

[cabber24]

So kind of a weird situation yesterday as apparently nobody told the kids about how the tie-breaker system works. They thought if they won (even in OT), they were in:

?Honestly when I scored, I thought we were in,? said MacKinnon. ?We were talking, maybe we shouldn?t have (celebrated) that hard.?

Except Sportsnet?s Scott Oake told MacKinnon that North America now needed winless Finland to beat Russia Thursday to advance. Johnny Gaudreau, who made the pass to MacKinnon, found out when he returned to the locker room and found downcast faces. The coaches knew what they needed to advance. They just didn?t tell the players.

?We knew that winning would do wonders for us,? said North America coach Todd McLellan. ?We knew that getting into the situation we ended in we would still need help. But as we went down the stretch, we played to win there.?

But they didn?t go after it at all costs, and they should have. After Sweden tied this thrilling, let-them-play-forever hockey game with 13:10 remaining in the third period, nobody was double-shifted. The most dangerous guys ? McDavid, Auston Matthews, Gaudreau, etc. ? weren?t left out there for extra-long shifts at the end. North America played a risk-reward scenario: They would rather try to win playing straight hockey against a Sweden team playing for overtime rather than tell the players, we need this. Go for it.

https://www.thestar.com/sports/hockey/2016/09/21/team-north-america-should-have-been-true-to-itself-against-sweden-arthur.html

Woops, maybe they could of let the players know... and also couldn't players figure it out themselves unless they were told otherwise?

 

[CarltonTheBear]

Pierre LeBrun ‏@Real_ESPNLeBrun
Lombardi felt skill on skill, had he taken all the most skilled players, didn't match up with Canada. So he went for a different mix...

Pierre LeBrun ‏@Real_ESPNLeBrun
Lombardi wanted 22 guys who cared to build right culture. He feels they got that right. But wonders if there was too much focus on Canada

Lombardi is literally the one person who put all the focus on Canada.

 

[bustaheims]

Pierre LeBrun ‏@Real_ESPNLeBrun
Lombardi felt skill on skill, had he taken all the most skilled players, didn't match up with Canada. So he went for a different mix...

Pierre LeBrun ‏@Real_ESPNLeBrun
Lombardi wanted 22 guys who cared to build right culture. He feels they got that right. But wonders if there was too much focus on Canada

Lombardi is literally the one person who put all the focus on Canada.

A team of our best players? Not good enough. You know what might be? A team that only has some of our best players, and a bunch of players that aren't as good as guys we're not going to invite. Less talent. That's the way you win this thing.

 

[Bates]

After the success and reaction to this year's team I highly doubt it's not repeated.

How about the 2020 World Cup Of Hockey as both will still be with the Young Guns?

The plan was for TNA and Team Europe to be put together for this tournament only. If there is a World Cup in 2020, the expectation is that there won't be a 23 and under team.

 

[mr grieves]

Yeah, they left scoring off the club and desperately needed it in a tight and short tourney. I think it was just some ribbing to USA brass while watching on helplessly from the couch while the team gets eliminated in two games. Plus the snub was an eyebrow raiser for many, he just led the playoffs in scoring. Not really burning a bridge, if they didn't put him on it now they never will.

Doubt anyone who built that embarrassment will be putting together future Team USA rosters.

 

[Frank E]

Pierre LeBrun ‏@Real_ESPNLeBrun
Lombardi felt skill on skill, had he taken all the most skilled players, didn't match up with Canada. So he went for a different mix...

Pierre LeBrun ‏@Real_ESPNLeBrun
Lombardi wanted 22 guys who cared to build right culture. He feels they got that right. But wonders if there was too much focus on Canada

Lombardi is literally the one person who put all the focus on Canada.

A team of our best players? Not good enough. You know what might be? A team that only has some of our best players, and a bunch of players that aren't as good as guys we're not going to invite. Less talent. That's the way you win this thing.

Well, let me play a little devil's advocate here.

1.  Canada hasn't won anything yet, so let's not get too far ahead of ourselves here.
2.  They were probably right that they wouldn't have been able to assemble enough talent to out-talent Canada, Kessel or no Kessel.  They got beat in Sochi with the guys many are suggesting should have been on this roster.  I'm not going to be too critical of them for trying a different angle after getting beat out of all the medals in Sochi.  They tried, and it didn't work.  It's not like this result was any worse than finishing 4th in the Olympics.  I actually would have been more critical of them if they didn't try something different after getting nothing but a participation ribbon at the last Olympics.

 

[herman]

1.  Canada hasn't won anything yet, so let's not get too far ahead of ourselves here.

Hasn't Canada won pretty much every game since they lost that preliminary match to the US in 2010, with largely the same an improving roster and coaching staff?

 

[Frank E]

1.  Canada hasn't won anything yet, so let's not get too far ahead of ourselves here.

Hasn't Canada won pretty much every game since they lost that preliminary match to the US in 2010, with largely the same an improving roster and coaching staff?

I was referring to the WCoH.

EDIT:  And I do think that loss in the exhibition game in the States is what encouraged Canada to put more sandpaper in the lineup with Perry, and later with O'Rielly.

I think they gave Canada a scare.