2018-19 Toronto Maple Leafs - General Discussion

[OldTimeHockey]

The way I read this is that a lot of a goalie's skill set is fixed already (genetics; age 5-20 development), their physical work habits at this level are typically pretty good or they wouldn't be here, but they have been exposed to no mental training and it makes a bigger difference than you'd expect.  It would be cool if they could actually measure the difference (eg: a decrease in "bad goals"/game?) ... I haven't read the article ...

There's also stuff about how goalies tend to be coached in the feeder leagues, where they are basically... not. The line rushes and skills and systems work that the teams do as a whole are pretty much not applicable to replicating game situations for goalies, so most coaches just kind of leave them off to do their own thing, but also have high expectations for them.

What are we referring to when mentioning "Feeder Leagues"?

There was a specific anecdote referring to a GTHL practice. Feeder leagues is just a catch-all term I chose.

I really should go back a bit further in the thread.

 

[OldTimeHockey]

The line rushes and skills and systems work that the teams do as a whole are pretty much not applicable to replicating game situations for goalies, so most coaches just kind of leave them off to do their own thing, but also have high expectations for them.

I think this is changing quickly.

When I played net 25 years ago, there was next to no coaching during practices for us goalies. We basically had to search out the local goalie coach and pay for tutoring out of our own pocket.

5-10 years after I left, I saw an increase in demand for coaches that knew how to work with goalies. This was coming more now from teams as opposed to parents. Today, on rep teams, a goalie coach is almost expected. We also put aside hundreds of dollars from our budget that goes towards our goalie training as well. Entire organizations also work out plans with local training facilities to once again work on the goalies.

In a typical practice I run for my daughter's competitive team, I allow 30 minutes for our goalie coach to work specifically with the goalies. The coach then stays on the ice for the remaining hour to continue to help out with only the goalies.

Coaches certainly do expect results from their goalies. Finally most of them have realized that proper coaching is what is needed.

 

[herman]

The way I read this is that a lot of a goalie's skill set is fixed already (genetics; age 5-20 development), their physical work habits at this level are typically pretty good or they wouldn't be here, but they have been exposed to no mental training and it makes a bigger difference than you'd expect.  It would be cool if they could actually measure the difference (eg: a decrease in "bad goals"/game?) ... I haven't read the article ...

There's also stuff about how goalies tend to be coached in the feeder leagues, where they are basically... not. The line rushes and skills and systems work that the teams do as a whole are pretty much not applicable to replicating game situations for goalies, so most coaches just kind of leave them off to do their own thing, but also have high expectations for them.

Briere is of the mind that "a confident goaltender is better than a good one any day of the week" so his development plans are designed to support building that confidence and mindset in his goalies. Like a lot of business/management seminars, it is predicated on determining the player's personality profile, establishing positive perspectives techniques, building up a foundation of achievable 'wins' in terms of daily goals. Briere culls a lot of these methodologies from non-hockey sources.

This article was written largely off of Briere's recent presentation he delivered at a conference, as the Leafs currently do not allow direct media access to support staff.

 

[herman]

https://theathletic.com/442342/2018/07/23/bourne-on-band-aid-players-and-why-thell-make-the-maple-leafs-forwards-even-better-than-you-think/

[Some] coaches are lucky enough to have what I call ?Band-Aid Players.? When you?re not a super deep team, not every line can be great. But if you have a Band-Aid player, you can put him with two guys who are the equivalent of open wounds, and that line will suddenly look a whole lot better. There were plenty of times discussions involved the phrase ?Well, should we give those two [Band-Aid Player]?? As in, ?They need a boost, maybe they should get some help in the form of [Band-Aid Player].?

Guess which three forwards are Band-Aid Players.

 

[cabber24]

https://theathletic.com/442342/2018/07/23/bourne-on-band-aid-players-and-why-thell-make-the-maple-leafs-forwards-even-better-than-you-think/

[Some] coaches are lucky enough to have what I call ?Band-Aid Players.? When you?re not a super deep team, not every line can be great. But if you have a Band-Aid player, you can put him with two guys who are the equivalent of open wounds, and that line will suddenly look a whole lot better. There were plenty of times discussions involved the phrase ?Well, should we give those two [Band-Aid Player]?? As in, ?They need a boost, maybe they should get some help in the form of [Band-Aid Player].?

Guess which three forwards are Band-Aid Players.

Marner, Marleau, and Kapanen?

 

[louisstamos]

https://theathletic.com/442342/2018/07/23/bourne-on-band-aid-players-and-why-thell-make-the-maple-leafs-forwards-even-better-than-you-think/

[Some] coaches are lucky enough to have what I call ?Band-Aid Players.? When you?re not a super deep team, not every line can be great. But if you have a Band-Aid player, you can put him with two guys who are the equivalent of open wounds, and that line will suddenly look a whole lot better. There were plenty of times discussions involved the phrase ?Well, should we give those two [Band-Aid Player]?? As in, ?They need a boost, maybe they should get some help in the form of [Band-Aid Player].?

Guess which three forwards are Band-Aid Players.

I would say Marner, Marleau and Brown.  I remember Brown getting put on the Bozak/JVR line as he's viewed as good defensively.

 

[herman]

Marner, Marleau, and Kapanen?

I would say Marner, Marleau and Brown.  I remember Brown getting put on the Bozak/JVR line as he's viewed as good defensively.

I really could rephrase it as which players do you think are the coach's favourites to play too high in the line up.

 

[cabber24]

Marner, Marleau, and Kapanen?

I would say Marner, Marleau and Brown.  I remember Brown getting put on the Bozak/JVR line as he's viewed as good defensively.

I really could rephrase it as which players do you think are the coach's favourites to play too high in the line up.

Hyman and Brown... no idea of a third that plays to high since we're pretty deep.

 

[louisstamos]

Marner, Marleau, and Kapanen?

I would say Marner, Marleau and Brown.  I remember Brown getting put on the Bozak/JVR line as he's viewed as good defensively.

I really could rephrase it as which players do you think are the coach's favourites to play too high in the line up.

Oh God, it's Komarov, isn't it.

 

[herman]

Oh God, it's Komarov, isn't it.

Formerly, yeah, that'd be accurate. I'd throw Martin on that boat too.

 

[herman]

The three Band-Aids, as Justin Bourne terms them, are Hyman, Brown, and Johnsson.

Plays hard every shift and practice, almost always in the right place at the right time on top of the play, does it without complaint because they're just happy to be there and happy to help.

I think Marleau is aging gracefully into this role, where he was once the go-to skill option.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

Dobberhockey already trademarked (not actually) the term for band-aid players with a completely different definition so that was a confusing article to me.

 

[herman]

Dobberhockey already trademarked (not actually) the term for band-aid players with a completely different definition so that was a confusing article to me.

https://dobberhockey.com/hockey-home/the-dobotomy/nhl-band-aid-boys-injury-prone/ these guys?

 

[CarltonTheBear]

Dobberhockey already trademarked (not actually) the term for band-aid players with a completely different definition so that was a confusing article to me.

https://dobberhockey.com/hockey-home/the-dobotomy/nhl-band-aid-boys-injury-prone/ these guys?

Yeah. Pick a new term Bourne!

 

[cabber24]

The three Band-Aids, as Justin Bourne terms them, are Hyman, Brown, and Johnsson.

Plays hard every shift and practice, almost always in the right place at the right time on top of the play, does it without complaint because they're just happy to be there and happy to help.

I think Marleau is aging gracefully into this role, where he was once the go-to skill option.

Brown and Hyman were our best players for the first 2 games of the playoffs. They're just flat our consistent and work hard... don't necessarily have that high end skill but real gud pros.

 

[cabber24]

The three Band-Aids, as Justin Bourne terms them, are Hyman, Brown, and Johnsson.

Plays hard every shift and practice, almost always in the right place at the right time on top of the play, does it without complaint because they're just happy to be there and happy to help.

I think Marleau is aging gracefully into this role, where he was once the go-to skill option.

I would not group Johnsson with those 2 skill wise but I do see the comparison from a work ethic and without complaint thing.

 

[cabber24]

A while ago on TSN radio they were taking calls about what the Leafs should give out in the dressing to the player of the game. The consensus best recommendation were thick Dubas style glasses. I think it would be hilarious.

 

[herman]

Dobberhockey already trademarked (not actually) the term for band-aid players with a completely different definition so that was a confusing article to me.

https://dobberhockey.com/hockey-home/the-dobotomy/nhl-band-aid-boys-injury-prone/ these guys?

Yeah. Pick a new term Bourne!

I would have personally termed them Josh Grobans.

 

[OldTimeHockey]

The way I read this is that a lot of a goalie's skill set is fixed already (genetics; age 5-20 development), their physical work habits at this level are typically pretty good or they wouldn't be here, but they have been exposed to no mental training and it makes a bigger difference than you'd expect.  It would be cool if they could actually measure the difference (eg: a decrease in "bad goals"/game?) ... I haven't read the article ...

There's also stuff about how goalies tend to be coached in the feeder leagues, where they are basically... not. The line rushes and skills and systems work that the teams do as a whole are pretty much not applicable to replicating game situations for goalies, so most coaches just kind of leave them off to do their own thing, but also have high expectations for them.

Briere is of the mind that "a confident goaltender is better than a good one any day of the week"

I would think that his thinking is more of the mind that a confident good goalie is better than a great goalie with no confidence. See Jose Theodore as an example. Once he couldn't use steroids for his hair anymore, he was more worried about going bald than stopping the puck

 

[Frank E]

The three Band-Aids, as Justin Bourne terms them, are Hyman, Brown, and Johnsson.

Plays hard every shift and practice, almost always in the right place at the right time on top of the play, does it without complaint because they're just happy to be there and happy to help.

I think Marleau is aging gracefully into this role, where he was once the go-to skill option.

Yeah, and I think this is one of those things that we fans never really know anything about - the management of personalities that a coach has to balance.

Like any manager of people experiences, you have some people that are maintenance free, and some that are high maintenance. 

Fans never know which ones are which, so we go off on coaches in terms of their shift management, when often times there are reasons that players are deployed in a certain way, or how often.  And it's not like a coach can say "well we did that because Whiny McWhiner was complaining that he wasn't getting enough OZ shifts, but he couldn't backcheck to save his life, so we needed a defensive guy on that line to babysit him."