2019-2020 NHL Thread

[hockeyfan1]

It'd be nice if the NHL could handle real problems with this much gusto like inconsistent reffing or the fact that DOPS has become a joke again.

Both goalies going down is such a rare occurrence.  Get rid of the EBUG all together.  Your goalies go down, you either play with an extra skater, or put one of your skaters in net. 

There should be an extra roster player / goalkeeper that travels with the team. 
The current EBUG situation as it stands is a little bit ridiculous.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

https://twitter.com/drosennhl/status/1234534398340599819

Surprisingly rational. There's no reason to change this.

 

[hockeyfan1]

[tweet]1234534398340599819[/tweet]

Surprisingly rational. There's no reason to change this.

Don?t ask a Leafs fan. 

 

[bustaheims]

Yeah. It's a non-issue, really.

Since the 1965-66 season, when the NHL mandated that a team must dress two goalies, there hadn't been a case where an EBUG played substantial minutes after both goalies were injured until Foster's 2018 appearance with the Blackhawks. It's now happened again in 2020. That's twice in close to 50,000 games.

An EBUG has seen the ice twice in more than 50 years.

 

[Hobbes]

It's done a lot to promote the game in a positive way in the last week too. That more than makes up for anything negative that could happen with a once-every-20,000-game event. Changing the rules because of this makes about as much sense as arresting someone for accidentally killing a seagull. Oh...erm...nevermind.

 

[Kin]

It's done a lot to promote the game in a positive way in the last week too.

That's pretty flukey though. If the Leafs had been even ok in that 3rd period they're probably winning that game and scoring 5-6 goals in the period and while that's no big tragedy I do think it's a fair question to ask about what would happen if that happened in a big game, especially when the Mrazek injury is one that historically teams have not done a great job in prioritizing over getting a guy back out there.

I don't think changing the rule is some sort of urgent necessity and I don't have any ready solutions but I feel like discussing the matter and coming up with better alternatives is still something worth exploring.

Edit: Especially if/since as I mentioned in the GDT, the way the Hurricanes responded to losing both goalies was to basically just play the Trap/Collapse around their goalie and rely on refs not making the interference calls that drove the trap out of the game. If that happened in a big game that would be terrible.

 

[Hobbes]

It's done a lot to promote the game in a positive way in the last week too.

That's pretty flukey though. If the Leafs had been even ok in that 3rd period they're probably winning that game and scoring 5-6 goals in the period and while that's no big tragedy I do think it's a fair question to ask about what would happen if that happened in a big game, especially when the Mrazek injury is one that historically teams have not done a great job in prioritizing over getting a guy back out there.

I don't think changing the rule is some sort of urgent necessity and I don't have any ready solutions but I feel like discussing the matter and coming up with better alternatives is still something worth exploring.

Sure, it could have had a different outcome that wasn't nearly as PR-friendly but there aren't a lot of good solutions to the issue when one takes into account how rarely it happens. I've heard or read a couple dozen different proposals and none of them makes a lot of sense unless it became a far more frequent occurrence. Statistically a team is only going to need that 3rd goaltender for a portion of one game every 322.58 seasons so even if someone wanted to do it for free, just the hotel and per-diem of an emergency goalie would be crazy since you'd have to cart him along to 41 road games.

I'm also not entirely sure that the number of possible Ayres alternatives is all that great. If anything, he's probably a lot more qualified than the NHL average EBUG on call since he actually faces NHL-caliber shooters fairly regularly. I think GMs have accepted that the odds of any EBUG being able to stop a beachball are pretty slim but have been okay with it for years because it basically never happens, and if you have to play part of one game that way, so be it.

I just can't imagine a solution that isn't going to be disproportionate to its cost (not to mention piss off the NHLPA since any EBUG costs would be coming out of HRR and taking money out of the "real" players' pockets). I presume they kicked a couple ideas around this morning and didn't feel like there was anything better and I'm fine with that.

 

[Kin]

Sure, it could have had a different outcome that wasn't nearly as PR-friendly but there aren't a lot of good solutions to the issue when one takes into account how rarely it happens. I've heard or read a couple dozen different proposals and none of them makes a lot of sense unless it became a far more frequent occurrence. Statistically a team is only going to need that 3rd goaltender for a portion of one game every 322.58 seasons so even if someone wanted to do it for free, just the hotel and per-diem of an emergency goalie would be crazy since you'd have to cart him along to 41 road games.

Right, but like I just said "it doesn't happen very often" would carry more weight in a sport that has historically been better in actually protecting players who are injured from going back out there. Particularly with the exact sort of injury that we saw on Saturday that prompted this in the first place. We don't really know how often this might have come up in a world where hockey teams took injuries seriously.

And, regardless, I don't think "this is a rare occurrence" is a really good counter to "Hey, maybe this can be done better. Let's look into it.".

I'm also not entirely sure that the number of possible Ayres alternatives is all that great.

Right, again, that's why I said I don't have an immediate and simple solution but that the issue is worth exploring.

I just can't imagine a solution that isn't going to be disproportionate to its cost (not to mention piss off the NHLPA since any EBUG costs would be coming out of HRR and taking money out of the "real" players' pockets).

Well, no. For starters that's not what HRR is. Paying an extra player wouldn't "come out of HRR" and there's no reason why you couldn't make it so that, say, emergency back up goalie was an actual team job paid for out of the owners end of things. Most of the extra costs would be pretty negligible for organizations that take in millions of dollars in revenue and could be handled by the league itself if Carolina or Arizona couldn't pony up the cost of one mid level employee.

But, again, that assumes that any solution would necessarily be involving an extra goalie on a roster. When, again, all I'm saying is an alternative solution is something worth thinking about

 

[Bates]

It's done a lot to promote the game in a positive way in the last week too.

That's pretty flukey though. If the Leafs had been even ok in that 3rd period they're probably winning that game and scoring 5-6 goals in the period and while that's no big tragedy I do think it's a fair question to ask about what would happen if that happened in a big game, especially when the Mrazek injury is one that historically teams have not done a great job in prioritizing over getting a guy back out there.

I don't think changing the rule is some sort of urgent necessity and I don't have any ready solutions but I feel like discussing the matter and coming up with better alternatives is still something worth exploring.

Sure, it could have had a different outcome that wasn't nearly as PR-friendly but there aren't a lot of good solutions to the issue when one takes into account how rarely it happens. I've heard or read a couple dozen different proposals and none of them makes a lot of sense unless it became a far more frequent occurrence. Statistically a team is only going to need that 3rd goaltender for a portion of one game every 322.58 seasons so even if someone wanted to do it for free, just the hotel and per-diem of an emergency goalie would be crazy since you'd have to cart him along to 41 road games.

I'm also not entirely sure that the number of possible Ayres alternatives is all that great. If anything, he's probably a lot more qualified than the NHL average EBUG on call since he actually faces NHL-caliber shooters fairly regularly. I think GMs have accepted that the odds of any EBUG being able to stop a beachball are pretty slim but have been okay with it for years because it basically never happens, and if you have to play part of one game that way, so be it.

I just can't imagine a solution that isn't going to be disproportionate to its cost (not to mention piss off the NHLPA since any EBUG costs would be coming out of HRR and taking money out of the "real" players' pockets). I presume they kicked a couple ideas around this morning and didn't feel like there was anything better and I'm fine with that.

Almost every team has "practice" goalies, just make that a paid position. It's then on you if they aren't up to snuff. Plenty of guys tired of the minors or Europe available for $100K and charter travel. 

 

[Kin]

I mean, even if you think that 2 goalies getting injured in a game is some laughable, billion to one shot why wouldn't you want the best possible solution? What if it happens in a game 7? And a series is decided by a weak goal on a guy who's technically an employee of the other team?

Even if this weren't a rough sport where injuries are common...I think it just makes sense for this to at least be a contingency that's adequately planned for.

I mean, imagine any other scenario where something like that could happen which would then have a major impact on something as important as a championship and it's happened a couple of times in the last few years and being like..."Nah, we don't need to come up with a better contingency plan".

Other sports are insulated from this. Basketball positions are fluid. Baseball teams have 15 person pitching staffs. Football has the wildcat offense. Hockey is really the only sport where two injuries can make a mockery of the rest of a game and this multi-billion dollar business can't come up with something better than whatever local amateur a team happens to have on hand?

 

[hockeyfan1]

I completely agree that there should be a solution to this EBUG situation.

As I said in another post, there should be a third goalkeeper on the roster that travels with the team.  A practice goalkeeper could be that guy.

I?m sure there can and should be a solution.

David Ayres gave the NHL plenty of publicity after the outcome of the Leafs /Carolina game.  What?s good for the sport may not always be good in the name of professionalism.  That game (where the home team needs to provide an EBUG) made a mockery of that in a way.

 

[L K]

Michael Hutchinson started a game for Colorado tonight and won.  17/18 shots in a 2-1 win over some non-NHL team.

 

[bustaheims]

Michael Hutchinson started a game for Colorado tonight and won.  17/18 shots in a 2-1 win over some non-NHL team.

He's generally been a pretty good AHL goalie, so, you know, good for him for finding his niche.

 

[bustaheims]

https://twitter.com/DarrenDreger/status/1234892386909728776

Look at the NHL, finally making the most obviously necessary change. Maybe. If the competition committee and the BoG approve.

 

[Kin]

The McDavid/Draisaitl Hart Trophy "debate" is legitimately the dumbest thing ina sport full of dumb things. Find me one real person, one, who would take Draisaitl over McDavid and it would have some merit.

Mind you, I say that fully aware that it virtually guarantees Draisaitl will win the Hart.

 

[bustaheims]

The McDavid/Draisaitl Hart Trophy "debate" is legitimately the dumbest thing ina sport full of dumb things. Find me one real person, one, who would take Draisaitl over McDavid and it would have some merit.

Mind you, I say that fully aware that it virtually guarantees Draisaitl will win the Hart.

I don't know. I think there's an argument that Draisaitl has been more important to the Oilers' success this season. He's definitely having a monster year. Edmonton turned their season around quite markedly after he and McDavid started getting most of their ES TOI on separate lines. I definitely wouldn't chose him over McDavid if I were building a team, but he might be the more valuable player this season.

 

[Peter D.]

https://twitter.com/DarrenDreger/status/1234892386909728776

Look at the NHL, finally making the most obviously necessary change. Maybe. If the competition committee and the BoG approve.

An obvious change that the NHL actually will follow through on.  I'm impressed.  Glad they came to their senses on that rule.  Trying to determine if a toenail was on the line or not was ridiculous.

 

[Kin]

I don't know. I think there's an argument that Draisaitl has been more important to the Oilers' success this season. He's definitely having a monster year. Edmonton turned their season around quite markedly after he and McDavid started getting most of their ES TOI on separate lines. I definitely wouldn't chose him over McDavid if I were building a team, but he might be the more valuable player this season.

So if you were the Oilers GM and could only have one guy healthy for the playoffs, who would it be?

 

[bustaheims]

I don't know. I think there's an argument that Draisaitl has been more important to the Oilers' success this season. He's definitely having a monster year. Edmonton turned their season around quite markedly after he and McDavid started getting most of their ES TOI on separate lines. I definitely wouldn't chose him over McDavid if I were building a team, but he might be the more valuable player this season.

So if you were the Oilers GM and could only have one guy healthy for the playoffs, who would it be?

Given the season he's having and their last exposure to the playoffs, I might actually lean toward Draisaitl.

 

[Kin]

Given the season he's having and their last exposure to the playoffs, I might actually lean toward Draisaitl.

Don't make me break out the Zoidberg meme.