OldTimeHockey
Active member
Bullfrog said:
I don't think it's complex at all. This here does not scream complex. This screams uneducated:
https://youtu.be/OmtfFAqUwtI
Coronavirus
- Thread starter Highlander
- Start date
I don't think it's complex at all. This here does not scream complex. This screams uneducated:
https://youtu.be/OmtfFAqUwtI
Heroic Shrimp
New member
https://twitter.com/TheDailyShow/status/1429956872103243777
herman
Well-known member
If you have time for a feature length movie, you could check out hbomberguy's breakdown of the anti-vax movement in his usual entertaining, curmudgeonly way.
Heroic Shrimp
New member
There are a lot of Phil Valentines to be found in r/HermanCainAward, inevitably updated constantly.
bustaheims
Active member
Heroic Shrimp said:
The most depressing and unnecessary Darwin Awards...
Bullfrog
Active member
OldTimeHockey said:
I think you missed the "particularly in the anti-vax crowd." It's not all from uneducated; I know some highly intelligent and educated people who are vehemently against vaccines.
What I'm saying is there isn't just one type of anti-vaxxer. There are several different reasons for being anti-vax. I suppose they do all distill down to ignorance and fear.
OldTimeHockey
Active member
Bullfrog said:
I think they distill down to ignorance and irrational fear.
And yes, you are correct, some people are "educated". Perhaps lack of intelligence is the proper term.
Bullfrog
Active member
Probably that. I just don't know because I can't put my head in that space.
My father-in-law is very intelligent with a really well-rounded knowledge set (both intellectually and mechanically), but yet...... chemtrails! And his electrical smart-meter is wrapped in tin-foil, literally.
I just don't get it.
My father-in-law is very intelligent with a really well-rounded knowledge set (both intellectually and mechanically), but yet...... chemtrails! And his electrical smart-meter is wrapped in tin-foil, literally.
I just don't get it.
herman
Well-known member
OldTimeHockey said:
Bullfrog said:
Identity politics, perhaps?
People just want to belong to a particular group/identity and will find ways to feed that sense of belonging with confirmation bias, especially if their identifying groups are intertwined with their value system. e.g. white Evangelicals getting co-opted by the GOP + 2nd Amendment folks.
Someone, somewhere, extrapolates their identity system to a piece of information that resonates emotionally and it just cascades from there. Even if educated (academically), how near and dear to your heart (core values) is your bachelors of science degree?
OldTimeHockey
Active member
herman said:
I still think it's a fear that drives people to these positions. Or at least a good number of them. I've found myself looking for excuses, or wanting to believe in conspiracy as it helps alleviate the fears that surrounds global warming, or Covid, or whatever the next "end of world" prediction comes up. Rather than face reality and the fear, we as humans always find the easy way out. Believing it's a global conspiracy that is causing global warming is easier than eating up some of the blame, standing up and helping shape policies, and quite simply facing the truth.
In regards to Covid, it's easier to say "the government is trying to control us, or it's all about tracking us" than it is to say "this is a really scary pandemic that has wiped out milions of peoples and my duty is to help curb the infection rate and get vaccinated."
In my mind, the first scenario is far scarier than the second, but for some reason, the fact that the man is "telling them what to do", it means they have to fight it with every ounce of strength in their bodies. And as I've alluded to, the 1st scenario is far closer to what you see on Netflix, so therefore more plausible to some.
Heroic Shrimp
New member
https://twitter.com/itosettiMD_MBA/status/1430327759692353537
Maybe Sweden didn't do such a great job after all.
Maybe Sweden didn't do such a great job after all.
Heroic Shrimp
New member
https://twitter.com/pharmersOnly_/status/1429845172272173062
bustaheims
Active member
Heroic Shrimp said:
This feels like a serious ethics violation.
Heroic Shrimp
New member
https://twitter.com/nothoodlum/status/1430556296902762503
herman said:
I am surprised healthcare companies all over the US aren?t doing this. *This* is personal responsibility (at least a little) ? you can choose not to vaccinate, but you have the responsibility to pay for your choice. The ?personal responsibility ? crowd is actually the ?abdication of responsibility? crowd.
Also, in reference to an earlier post ? there is no way to do a risk assessment in which one comes to the conclusion that it is riskier to get the vaccine than not unless you are someone who is completely isolated from other humans and plan to be that way for the foreseeable future. Otherwise, eventually (and likely pretty soon) you are going to come in contact with covid. So the choice is either get covid or get vaccinated (and probably come in contact with covid while vaccinated).
The known short term effects of covid are vastly more dangerous and prevalent than the known short term side effects of the vaccine.
The known long term effects (long covid) are vastly worse and more prevalent than the known long term effects of the vaccine.
Doctors think that long term effects from the vaccine are unlikely because it doesn?t take too long for the vaccine to be purged from one?s body and we?ve had millions of people taking the vaccine for 8 months now, and 10s of thousands in clinical trials for a year or so.
Could there be unknown side effects of the vaccine? Perhaps. But there?s no scientific reason to more heavily weight the risk of unknowns from the vaccine than similar unknowns (and knowns! from the virus).
There?s just no rational, scientific risk assessment where you can come to the conclusion that taking, say, Pfizer is a bad move unless you have some particular medical history that suggests there could be a problem. Anyone who argues otherwise is simply misinformed or making a faulty argument.
Of course, people can simply value inclusion in their peer group (Eg, inclusion in the Republican death cult) above taking precautions vis-a-vis their own health and the health of others in their community. That?s possibly a rational choice ? choosing to feel good about their expression of ?freedom? versus helping themselves and their communities weather the pandemic. Although it does seem as though at least some people wind up regretting that choice when they are on a ventilator.
The known short term effects of covid are vastly more dangerous and prevalent than the known short term side effects of the vaccine.
The known long term effects (long covid) are vastly worse and more prevalent than the known long term effects of the vaccine.
Doctors think that long term effects from the vaccine are unlikely because it doesn?t take too long for the vaccine to be purged from one?s body and we?ve had millions of people taking the vaccine for 8 months now, and 10s of thousands in clinical trials for a year or so.
Could there be unknown side effects of the vaccine? Perhaps. But there?s no scientific reason to more heavily weight the risk of unknowns from the vaccine than similar unknowns (and knowns! from the virus).
There?s just no rational, scientific risk assessment where you can come to the conclusion that taking, say, Pfizer is a bad move unless you have some particular medical history that suggests there could be a problem. Anyone who argues otherwise is simply misinformed or making a faulty argument.
Of course, people can simply value inclusion in their peer group (Eg, inclusion in the Republican death cult) above taking precautions vis-a-vis their own health and the health of others in their community. That?s possibly a rational choice ? choosing to feel good about their expression of ?freedom? versus helping themselves and their communities weather the pandemic. Although it does seem as though at least some people wind up regretting that choice when they are on a ventilator.
Heroic Shrimp
New member
Ethics are for losers who don't love money enough.bustaheims said: