Leafs Sign Shawn Matthias

[Frank E]

If we can ship out Bozak + another contract, would you pick up Booth and Santorelli again to go with Matthias? just to complete the Panther>Canuck>Leaf collection.

No. I'd like to see some youth on the team next year and already the Leafs have too many forwards under contract. Hyman and Bailey should be on the team next year and there is a point of diminishing returns when adding veterans.

I was thinking about the Hyman and Bailey thing...like I don't think they would have signed with the Leafs to play in the AHL.  Bailey signed that deal on condition that a year was burned off last season.  With him being under contract for only 1 more season, I'd bet he's under the impression that he's playing in the NHL this year. 

They are 23.

 

[bustaheims]

Holland wouldn't be my first choice either but at some point you just have to look at the roster and look at who might get squeezed out. I assume that they want the guys they've signed to make the team and they've added quite a few centers.

I wonder if maybe a lot of that is a reaction to the lack of center depth the team has had over the past few seasons. Most teams like to have a few guys on the wing with some center experience. The Leafs have been lacking that of late. I also think it's kind of telling that almost all of these guys have only been brought in on one year deals. They're here to provide flexibility in case potential trades present themselves, but I don't think they've been brought in to push anyone off the roster or because of any impending deals.

 

[Bullfrog]

I have to assume his 18 goals last year was somewhat like Clarkson's 30 goal season?

I don't now.  In the lockout year he had 14 goals in 48 games (24 goal pace).  I think with a sizeable role that maybe he overachieves and looks to be on a 20 goal pace come the draft deadline.

True, but Kadri had 44 pts in 48 games that year too. I personally believe Kadri reaching that level again is more likely.

I'm often suspect of guys with a high goal to assist ratio.

 

[Kin]

Holland wouldn't be my first choice either but at some point you just have to look at the roster and look at who might get squeezed out. I assume that they want the guys they've signed to make the team and they've added quite a few centers.

I wonder if maybe a lot of that is a reaction to the lack of center depth the team has had over the past few seasons. Most teams like to have a few guys on the wing with some center experience. The Leafs have been lacking that of late. I also think it's kind of telling that almost all of these guys have only been brought in on one year deals. They're here to provide flexibility in case potential trades present themselves, but I don't think they've been brought in to push anyone off the roster or because of any impending deals.

That certainly makes sense but someone's got to be getting pushed out all the same. I mean they have 12 forwards(13 if you include Horton) under contract now not including Bailey and Hyman.

 

[Frank E]

Holland wouldn't be my first choice either but at some point you just have to look at the roster and look at who might get squeezed out. I assume that they want the guys they've signed to make the team and they've added quite a few centers.

I wonder if maybe a lot of that is a reaction to the lack of center depth the team has had over the past few seasons. Most teams like to have a few guys on the wing with some center experience. The Leafs have been lacking that of late. I also think it's kind of telling that almost all of these guys have only been brought in on one year deals. They're here to provide flexibility in case potential trades present themselves, but I don't think they've been brought in to push anyone off the roster or because of any impending deals.

I don't know Busta...I think the depth is what you sign in August when things have settled a bit, and you need some depth for $1mil.  I don't think it's the same when you're signing $2+ million in the first week of free agency.

 

[herman]

If we can ship out Bozak + another contract, would you pick up Booth and Santorelli again to go with Matthias? just to complete the Panther>Canuck>Leaf collection.

No. I'd like to see some youth on the team next year and already the Leafs have too many forwards under contract. Hyman and Bailey should be on the team next year and there is a point of diminishing returns when adding veterans.

I keep forgetting about those two. I kind of expected them to be on the Marlies until after the deadline.

 

[Kin]

I keep forgetting about those two. I kind of expected them to be on the Marlies until after the deadline.

Well, aside from the problem of those guys being 23 that would also create a pretty big logjam with the Marlies. If they're added to the mix then you're going to be in a situation where pretty legitimate prospects are either on the 4th line or in the ECHL.

I know the team has talked about using the ECHL team like single A but I don't think you want that with good prospects.

 

[herman]

I keep forgetting about those two. I kind of expected them to be on the Marlies until after the deadline.

Well, aside from the problem of those guys being 23 that would also create a pretty big logjam with the Marlies. If they're added to the mix then you're going to be in a situation where pretty legitimate prospects are either on the 4th line or in the ECHL.

I know the team has talked about using the ECHL team like single A but I don't think you want that with good prospects.

I don't know enough about the Marlies, but CapFriendly shows 12 forwards with contracts, including Bailey and Hyman. I assume this is just the list of players under contract with the Leafs, rather than actually on the Marlie roster, as their 2014-15 list has a few more names.

Maybe Leafs?:
Bailey
Hyman
Froese

Baby Leafs:
Nylander
Kapanen
Brown
Gauthier
Leivo
Leipsic
Rupert
Carrick
Devane
Clune
Soshnikov

Feeder Leafs:
Verhaeghe (OHL)
Johnson (SHL)

Perhaps the lower ceiling players end up being the ones pushed up to the Leafs ( Carrick/Leivo/Devane/Rupert/Froese) rather than the unknown players of interest (Soshnikov/Hyman/Bailey) who can work on their games in the AHL.

 

[bustaheims]

I don't know Busta...I think the depth is what you sign in August when things have settled a bit, and you need some depth for $1mil.  I don't think it's the same when you're signing $2+ million in the first week of free agency.

AHL depth, sure. Or when you're a team that strapped for cap space. A team in the Leafs' position can afford to throw a little extra dough around for depth early in the process, so that they get the guys they want and, hopefully, the guys that will have the best value come deadline day. There generally aren't many signings in August. At that point, it's usually training camp invite type arrangements.

 

[bustaheims]

That certainly makes sense but someone's got to be getting pushed out all the same. I mean they have 12 forwards(13 if you include Horton) under contract now not including Bailey and Hyman.

We might see a rotating 12th forward type situation, but it wouldn't surprise me if both those guys start the year with the Marlies if everyone is healthy. At least one of them almost certainly will.

 

[Kin]

Perhaps the lower ceiling players end up being the ones pushed up to the Leafs ( Carrick/Leivo/Devane/Rupert/Froese) rather than the unknown players of interest (Soshnikov/Hyman/Bailey) who can work on their games in the AHL.

But like I said, it's not just a question of where these guys are, it's also a question of getting the prospects ice time. Even if he's got limited potential I don't really want Gauthier on the Marlies 4th line next year. Certainly not just so the team can squeeze a few more pieces of tradebait onto the Leafs.

 

[bustaheims]

But like I said, it's not just a question of where these guys are, it's also a question of getting the prospects ice time. Even if he's got limited potential I don't really want Gauthier on the Marlies 4th line next year. Certainly not just so the team can squeeze a few more pieces of tradebait onto the Leafs.

Well, that's where the plan to use the ECHL team as a 2nd tier development team comes into play. Some of the guys that are further from the NHL or that need more ice time will be getting it there to start off, and they'll move around based on play, moves made by the Leafs, injuries, etc. Someone like Gauthier, for instance, could see himself as the 1st line center in the ECHL to start the season.

 

[Kin]

Well, that's where the plan to use the ECHL team as a 2nd tier development team comes into play. Some of the guys that are further from the NHL or that need more ice time will be getting it there to start off, and they'll move around based on play, moves made by the Leafs, injuries, etc. Someone like Gauthier, for instance, could see himself as the 1st line center in the ECHL to start the season.

No, I mentioned that. I'm fine with that if the team thinks the ECHL is best for a player's development but not just so we can have more veterans on the Leafs 4th line. Like I said, there are diminishing returns here.

 

[Captain Canuck]

Matthias can play center or wing so this is looking like another nail in Bozak's coffin.
Too many bodies up front now as it stands, particularly up the middle.

I could see Matthias score 20 next year (although maybe not all with the Leafs if he's dealt at the deadline).

 

[hobarth]

I would think that Parenteau, Mathias and other such signings are being made to move those players to pick up more assets during the season then TO will graduate the worthy.

Well, that's where the plan to use the ECHL team as a 2nd tier development team comes into play. Some of the guys that are further from the NHL or that need more ice time will be getting it there to start off, and they'll move around based on play, moves made by the Leafs, injuries, etc. Someone like Gauthier, for instance, could see himself as the 1st line center in the ECHL to start the season.

No, I mentioned that. I'm fine with that if the team thinks the ECHL is best for a player's development but not just so we can have more veterans on the Leafs 4th line. Like I said, there are diminishing returns here.

I'm getting the opinion that TO is writing off the next year and probably not wanting to expose the young to the constant losing so the team is being flooded with cheap players. I don't think you or anybody wants to see Nylander or Gauthier playing 7 minutes a game on TO's 4th line so I think what's going on makes sense so far. What I don't want to see is TO signing aged vets to AHL contracts taking Nylander's and Gauthier's icetime with the Marlies. 

 

[Highlander]

This could be sacrilege, nailing Bozak the Clown onto some wood whether a coffin or other (say Maple) could come back to haunt us, likes Phils 47 goals (30 against the Loafs) next year and not resigning Booth.

 

[Kin]

I'm getting the opinion that TO is writing off the next year and probably not wanting to expose the young to the constant losing so the team is being flooded with cheap players. I don't think you or anybody wants to see Nylander or Gauthier playing 7 minutes a game on TO's 4th line so I think what's going on makes sense so far.

Nylander or Gauthier? No. But guys like Leivo, Bailey, Hyman and prospects of that nature? I do want to see them on the 4th line. Given the overall weakness of the team there's really no reason why the 4th line would be getting 7 minutes a night, and 10-12 is more likely.

 

[L K]

I'm starting to waver just a little bit on just how bad this team is going to be (barring further changes).  Sure, we lost Kessel and that's a big loss offensively but they also added a bunch of guys who are capable of putting up 20 goals.  The defense at this point is the same defense that we had last year (Plus Marincin, Hunwick and Harrington). 

I don't mean to imply that this is a team that is going to be fighting for 8th place but I'm not convinced this is a team that is guaranteed to be bottom 2.

 

[bustaheims]

No, I mentioned that. I'm fine with that if the team thinks the ECHL is best for a player's development but not just so we can have more veterans on the Leafs 4th line. Like I said, there are diminishing returns here.

Long-term, I agree. But, for next season in particular? I don't know. With all the signings being made, I think it indicates that they don't feel too many of the guys you bring up are ready for full-time duty in the NHL yet. Of the older forward prospects with real NHL potential, only Leivo (and maybe Carrick, depending on how you feel about his potential) has professional experience of any significance.

 

[Joe S.]

I'm starting to waver just a little bit on just how bad this team is going to be (barring further changes).  Sure, we lost Kessel and that's a big loss offensively but they also added a bunch of guys who are capable of putting up 20 goals.  The defense at this point is the same defense that we had last year (Plus Marincin, Hunwick and Harrington). 

I don't mean to imply that this is a team that is going to be fighting for 8th place but I'm not convinced this is a team that is guaranteed to be bottom 2.

I think it comes down to goaltending. If Bernier can have the season we've all been expecting him too,  then I really think this team is going to be better than most expect.