Post Mortem

[bustaheims]

I think I'd honestly have to take a break from this team if that happened. Callahan would be Clarkson 2.0.

I don't think it would be quite that bad, because Callahan is a much more talented player than Clarkson, but, because of Clarkson, the Leafs can't really afford to make that move. Of course, I'm advocating pretty much abstaining from any UFAs that are looking for big money or term, so, obviously, I'd be on board with not signing him regardless.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

I don't think it would be quite that bad, because Callahan is a much more talented player than Clarkson, but, because of Clarkson, the Leafs can't really afford to make that move. Of course, I'm advocating pretty much abstaining from any UFAs that are looking for big money or term, so, obviously, I'd be on board with not signing him regardless.

They'll both be overpaid by a similar amount. Callahan's a better player but he's still going to get $2-3mil per more than I would give him plus an extra 2 or 3 years more on the term.

 

[nutman]

I think the Leaf management team should take the players one by one, and question them on there issues with there coach, and teammates. Tell them it will not leave the room, nor play against them in any way. This should find a common ground with the issues that need looked at from the players end. I'll bet it would go a long way in showing them who needs to be shown the door. Someone or some thing put this team in a tail spin after the Olympic break.

 

[iwas11in67]

Seems to me that the Leafs played 'scared' this season. Scared to not repeat the Boston meltdown. No team gets outshot in every game. Even though I don't like him there's no way Dion has another horrible season like this past one. Same with Clarkson. I would trade Gunner and Kadri (and probably some other minor pieces) to get an impact defenceman.

 

[applecheeks]

I think the Leaf management team should take the players one by one, and question them on there issues with there coach, and teammates. Tell them it will not leave the room, nor play against them in any way. This should find a common ground with the issues that need looked at from the players end. I'll bet it would go a long way in showing them who needs to be shown the door. Someone or some thing put this team in a tail spin after the Olympic break.

IMO It's the same reason Calgary gave away the cancer in their dressing room. Not the player we thought we were getting. good/not good enough to lead a team as their captain.
Find a coach that can inspire and motivate these overpaid atheletes.

 

[Optimus Reimer]

This from Dr. Quincy:

Leafs died from heart failure and had poor coaching that led to the heart failure.

 

[Britishbulldog]

I would rejig the roster as follows:

JVR Bozak Kessel (for another go around)
Lupul Kadri __Kane_____ (new legit top six two-way winger, not Kuli)
__Kulemin__ BHolland Clarkson (not sure about left side, would like an upgrade on Mason or Kuli)
Kuli Ashton McClement Komarov Bodie would be okay.

___Rielly_____ and Gardiner Weber
Phanuef  Gudbranson
_MacWilliam_ and __Bortuzzo_ ?? (tough stay at home and a puck moving skater)

Bernier and _Chad Johnson____?

There slapshot, I filled in the blanks for you.  ;D

The Leafs depth took a beating but here is what happened:

Traded '88 Reimer, '86 Gunnarson and '93 Percy for '91 Kane.

Traded '90 Gardiner, '83 Lupul, and 2014 Leafs 1st pick for '85 Weber. (Since Kane replaces Lupul's scoring and skill on the 2nd line I would try to trade Lupul and move Kulemin and Ashton each up a line and put a different Marlie like Broll or Devane as 4th line LW)

Traded RFA '87 Franson (who isn't as bad as some say) and '93 Leivo for RFA '92 Gudbranson (who isn't as good as some say)

Traded '88 Holzer 6th-7th dman and '93 Biggs for '89 Bortuzzo 6th-7th dman

Signed the best available UFA goalie for $1 MIL.  It could be anyone.

 

[Bullfrog]

Traded '90 Gardiner, '83 Lupul, and 2014 Leafs 1st pick for '85 Weber. (Since Kane replaces Lupul's scoring and skill on the 2nd line I would try to trade Lupul and move Kulemin and Ashton each up a line and put a different Marlie like Broll or Devane as 4th line LW)

I don't think that's enough for Weber. Add at least another 1st round pick or two.

 

[pmrules]

I would rejig the roster as follows:

JVR Bozak Kessel (for another go around)
Lupul Kadri __Kane_____ (new legit top six two-way winger, not Kuli)
__Kulemin__ BHolland Clarkson (not sure about left side, would like an upgrade on Mason or Kuli)
Kuli Ashton McClement Komarov Bodie would be okay.

___Rielly_____ and Gardiner Weber
Phanuef  Gudbranson
_MacWilliam_ and __Bortuzzo_ ?? (tough stay at home and a puck moving skater)

Bernier and _Chad Johnson____?

There slapshot, I filled in the blanks for you.  ;D

The Leafs depth took a beating but here is what happened:

Traded '88 Reimer, '86 Gunnarson and '93 Percy for '91 Kane.

Traded '90 Gardiner, '83 Lupul, and 2014 Leafs 1st pick for '85 Weber. (Since Kane replaces Lupul's scoring and skill on the 2nd line I would try to trade Lupul and move Kulemin and Ashton each up a line and put a different Marlie like Broll or Devane as 4th line LW)

Traded RFA '87 Franson (who isn't as bad as some say) and '93 Leivo for RFA '92 Gudbranson (who isn't as good as some say)

Traded '88 Holzer 6th-7th dman and '93 Biggs for '89 Bortuzzo 6th-7th dman

Signed the best available UFA goalie for $1 MIL.  It could be anyone.

I love how you keep putting their year of birth in the names of the players.  Just out of curiosity, Why do you do that and how do you know them off by heart (at least it seems you do)?

I also love the consistency in bringing in Weber by you.  He is exactly what this team needs (i.e. a true #1 that brings every d-man down a position in the roster), but I don't think its as easy as you think it is without giving up more of our top assets.  (hmmm...Kessel for Weber? Don't know if I'd do it, but i would at least think about it)

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

Was going to say Kane was born in 1988...but completely forgot there are two Kanes.

 

[bustaheims]

While I appreciate your enthusiasm, there's no way Nashville makes that deal. Trading Weber is a franchise changing move for them, and that's not enough to entire them (and, if Weber is available, that wouldn't be the best offer out there, either). I don't think Florida trade Gudbranson for that package, either.

 

[L K]

Listening to the talking heads:

- It's not Carlyle's fault that this team has been awful
- The players are all at fault because they lack character

Why the hell is Carlyle not someone who needs to be accountable for a team that no-shows every night.  I will completely accept that if you have a team that won't compete that a coach is stuck in a difficult situation.  You know what you do then?  You change up your lineup.  Carlyle didn't do that...at all.

And if this is a team that essentially top to bottom doesn't care, then why sign them to long-term extensions.

60 wins and 61 losses in games ended at the end of OT (10-16 in shootouts)

 

[Kin]

I will completely accept that if you have a team that won't compete that a coach is stuck in a difficult situation.  You know what you do then?  You change up your lineup.  Carlyle didn't do that...at all.

If the argument is that the problem is a mental one, or at least one related to "character" or, ugh, "compete level" then what's the argument for shaking up the line-up addressing that? Isn't that more or less the literal translation of shuffling deck chairs on the titanic?

 

[L K]

I will completely accept that if you have a team that won't compete that a coach is stuck in a difficult situation.  You know what you do then?  You change up your lineup.  Carlyle didn't do that...at all.

If the argument is that the problem is a mental one, or at least one related to "character" or, ugh, "compete level" then what's the argument for shaking up the line-up addressing that? Isn't that more or less the literal translation of shuffling deck chairs on the titanic?

I don't think there is one, to be honest.  Bottom line for me, this is a team that needs improvement in all facets.  They need a better coach.  They need a better defense and they need better forwards.  You can't do all of that in one off-season, but the notion that you need to keep the coach who captains a trainwreck just seems asinine.  They need to fix their scouting system.  They need to adjust their front office.

The justification for keeping Carlyle seems to be, hey, he won a Cup.  That shouldn't be dismissed outright, but it is something that happened 9 years ago.  He has 1 playoff series win in the subsequent 8 years.    That's not something that should be looked on favourable. 

 

[Kin]

I don't think there is one, to be honest.  Bottom line for me, this is a team that needs improvement in all facets.  They need a better coach.  They need a better defense and they need better forwards.  You can't do all of that in one off-season, but the notion that you need to keep the coach who captains a trainwreck just seems asinine.  They need to fix their scouting system.  They need to adjust their front office.

The justification for keeping Carlyle seems to be, hey, he won a Cup.  That shouldn't be dismissed outright, but it is something that happened 9 years ago.  He has 1 playoff series win in the subsequent 8 years.    That's not something that should be looked on favourable.

I'm not defending Carlyle or making a case for keeping him, I'm just saying that if there is a perception that the Maple Leafs players lack a certain drive or make-up or "mental toughness" or whatever then there really isn't an easy solution to that, regardless of coaching acumen and it speaks to the sort of organizational overhaul you're talking about rather than being a strike against the coach.

 

[Optimus Reimer]

Listening to the talking heads:

- It's not Carlyle's fault that this team has been awful
- The players are all at fault because they lack character

Why the hell is Carlyle not someone who needs to be accountable for a team that no-shows every night.  I will completely accept that if you have a team that won't compete that a coach is stuck in a difficult situation.  You know what you do then?  You change up your lineup.  Carlyle didn't do that...at all.

And if this is a team that essentially top to bottom doesn't care, then why sign them to long-term extensions.

60 wins and 61 losses in games ended at the end of OT (10-16 in shootouts)

I am still under the impression Carlyle said or did something that pissed of the entire team.  If a coach unfairly bashes at least one of the players, then he might as well have bashed the entire team because the players will stick up for each other in those situations, and the end result has always been the coach is fired.

I just cannot figure out how a half decent team can just simply suck for about 20 games. 

 

[Kin]

I am still under the impression Carlyle said or did something that pissed of the entire team.  If a coach unfairly bashes at least one of the players, then he might as well have bashed the entire team because the players will stick up for each other in those situations, and the end result has always been the coach is fired.

I just cannot figure out how a half decent team can just simply suck for about 20 games.

They were more or less just as bad in December. It can't all be because Carlyle hurt someone's feelings.

 

[Britishbulldog]

I love how you keep putting their year of birth in the names of the players.  Just out of curiosity, Why do you do that and how do you know them off by heart (at least it seems you do)?

I also love the consistency in bringing in Weber by you.  He is exactly what this team needs (i.e. a true #1 that brings every d-man down a position in the roster), but I don't think its as easy as you think it is without giving up more of our top assets.  (hmmm...Kessel for Weber? Don't know if I'd do it, but i would at least think about it)

Hey pmrules, you caught me on one of strengths/dark side of the moon things.  For better or worse I can never analyze something half way.  I am either flippant or extremely thorough.  With my role running an independent TV production house I have been responsible for staffing, banking negotiations, insurance purchasing, lawyer liaison, broadcaster contract negotiator, etc which feeds my quirkiness nicely.

Unfortunately because of my life away from tmlfans.ca, I don't have a lot of time to watch hockey so I rely on opinions expressed here, media reports and hilight packages.

I like to balance assets for longevity of success of an organization balanced with experience hence my obsession with ages.

Through those avenues I will be EXTREMELY concise on how I look at the 1st trade:
I have seen Reimer let is some soft goals compared to last year, heard Leiweke state last week that Bernier is the goalie that will lead the Leafs to the Cup, that Reimer is going to discretely ask for a trade this summer and that Kane has now been in and out of the doghouse with 2 coaches since Atlanta moved to Winnipeg, that Kane has been in and out of favour with the fans due to his play on the ice as well as his activities off the ice and lastly I have read 2 reputable reports that they don't think that Kane will finish his contract in Winnipeg.  Add to that the horrific year that Pavelec has had making people ponder if he should be bought out PLUS watching Byfyglien excel at forward rather than defense and the stability that Gunnarsson would provide Winnipeg at defense draws the main points out why I believe Toronto and Winnipeg would be good trading partners. 

An additional Leaf asset would most likely be needed to sweeten the pot.  There are a few other things that I believe would be needed to complete the deal but those are even more boring to most than my main points.

The cool thing about when I am away from my friends here and managing projects I do get to work with neat people like 6'10" Robert Maillet (WWE, Sherlock Holmes, 300, Pacific Rim, Mortal Instruments, and the upcoming Paul Walker movie that was shot in Montreal - Brick Mansions.  Robert is at the end of the trailer)

 

[Britishbulldog]

While I appreciate your enthusiasm, there's no way Nashville makes that deal. Trading Weber is a franchise changing move for them, and that's not enough to entire them (and, if Weber is available, that wouldn't be the best offer out there, either). I don't think Florida trade Gudbranson for that package, either.

Hey bustaheims,

Getting another break here from responsibilities to expound my methods of madness on the 5 players I suggested:

The players I usually pick to get for the Leafs are usually not realistic but embody what I think is needed.  So the players I suggest break down in my mind this way:

Weber - after watching few Nashville games I noticed that, like Phaneuf, Weber makes some bad passes, sometimes pinches when he shouldn't, sometimes gets skated around on a rush from a speedy forward and has a rocket of a shot that sometimes misses the net.  Weber is going to make a staggering $53 MIL the next 4 years compared to Phaneuf's $28 MIL.  So why to I doggedly suggest him?  Like everyone else here I would love the Leafs to have a big 6'4" dman that can play against other teams top players, have decent mobility and score goals.  Can a 'Shea Weber' be developed in the Leafs system?  I don't know.  He not only was not the top dman drafted his draft year, he wasn't even Nashville's 1st dman drafted his draft year.  He was Nashville's 3rd dman drafted.    Will the Leafs 3rd dman drafted this year become a 'Shea Weber'? Don't know.  Boston's franchise players Chara 3rd RD NYI, Rask 21st overall TOR,  Lucic late 2nd RD 2006 are all way outside the top 10 picks in the draft and only one is a Boston draft pick.  Shea Weber would change the attitude and culture on the Leafs D corps  enough that including Phaneuf in the trade would hurt but would make sense.  Phaneuf and Lupul for Shea Weber??

****chance to get 'the' Shea Weber - unrealistic but that is the kind of player I want...like everyone else****

Gudbranson - another stereotype for me that if a different player fit it I would happily switch to the other player.  Big, smooth skating, tough but not looking for fights and has a rocket of a shot.  ****chance to get Erik Gudbranson - unrealistic but that is the kind of player I want****

E Kane - fast, hits, great shot and can fight middleweights if forced to BUT has had problems on and off the ice with coaches and fans.  ****chance to get Evander Kane - realistic if he is what the Leafs need for the price asked by Winnipeg****

Bortuzzo - another stereotype for me that if a different player fit it I would happily switch to the other player.  Big, tough and can fight to protect his team mates if needed.  ****chance to get Rob Bortuzzo - realistic since with a healthy d corps this week Pittsburgh scratched Bortuzzo and Engelland but if Pittsburgh doesn't include him in their top 6 you realize he is more comparable to Mark Fraser than Shea Weber****

UFA goalie - $.9 - $1 MIL will snag a good one.

Anyway, that is why my trades are unfortunately ludicrous. As you guys graciously comment on them I try to think of other ways to make them happen. 

 

[LuncheonMeat]

gleason is a waste of time, I saw him get undressed in Phoenix this winter and it was bad.  We need MacWilliam or Nodule or even Percy whom looks poised beyong his years with the Marlies.

Fat?

;D