TRADE DAY: Sandin / Engvall / Schenn

[cw]

In order to be a top guy he needs to be able to play the heavy game. Sandin by your own admission is never going to play that game. I think you're overvaluing him. The PP is 27% with Rielly and 17% without him.

Lidstrom?
Leetch?
Niedermayer?

I don't recall them playing a "heavy" game.
I think Sandin is as physical as any of those players - maybe a little more so.

But like most, I don't think he's ever going to be an elite dman like those guys.

He's currently enjoying more ice time with Carlson being out. He'll come back to earth some when Carlson returns.
When the dust settles, I think he'll be a decent top 4 at ES & PP and not much PK.
Next year, at $1.4 mil, he'll be one of the better cap values in the NHL along with Liljegren.
If he stays healthy, he'll have a good NHL career.

 

[L K]

Three games doesn't a bad trade make but I really do wonder with Keefe's "Liljegren needs to be better" nonsense after benching him is a bit of an indication that Keefe went too far down the "rookie/youth bad; veteran good" mentality with Sandin and should have been pushing him more instead of sheltering him.

I don't think it's nonsense with Liljegren. He had a bad game against EDM. He also benched Holl for a game as well a few weeks ago. Like he said at the time, don't give me a reason to take you out. Leafs have lots of options now and .
As for Sandin, he was given the chance to take over for Rielly when he was out and if memory serves it didn't go so well. The PP struggled to the point where Keefe took him off PP1. It's also pretty clear he can't handle the heavy game. He's not good at clearing the front of the net, boxing guys out and struggles against larger opponents on the rush and in the corners. 
Getting McCabe put him on the outside looking in again.

I like Sandin but he's been with the Leafs for 5 years now and some of those issues aren't going to change. He's a good 3rd pairing guy and maybe a #4 on a lower team. I think the Leafs sold high on him and got a 1st rounder for him before he became Dermott 2.0. 
As for his first 3 games in Wash, good on him

He was given the opportunity after missing half of training camp and got the opportunity for a handful of games.
He's 23.  When Rielly was 23 he was putting up a 6 goal 27 point season.  Holding Sandin to the same standard as a more established Rielly seems like an unfair expectation.

 

[bustaheims]

He's currently enjoying more ice time with Carlson being out. He'll come back to earth some when Carlson returns.
When the dust settles, I think he'll be a decent top 4 at ES & PP and not much PK.
Next year, at $1.4 mil, he'll be one of the better cap values in the NHL along with Liljegren.
If he stays healthy, he'll have a good NHL career.

Yeah. I think he'll end up being a pretty standard 2nd pairing guy - which is good for him, but nothing to really cry over losing. There's a good number of those types around the league and they move around pretty frequently.

He's like a Paul Martin or a JM Liles - a good piece to have around, but not really a game changer.

 

[Frank E]

He's currently enjoying more ice time with Carlson being out. He'll come back to earth some when Carlson returns.
When the dust settles, I think he'll be a decent top 4 at ES & PP and not much PK.
Next year, at $1.4 mil, he'll be one of the better cap values in the NHL along with Liljegren.
If he stays healthy, he'll have a good NHL career.

Yeah. I think he'll end up being a pretty standard 2nd pairing guy - which is good for him, but nothing to really cry over losing. There's a good number of those types around the league and they move around pretty frequently.

He's like a Paul Martin or a JM Liles - a good piece to have around, but not really a game changer.

Archived. 

 

[CarltonTheBear]

He's currently enjoying more ice time with Carlson being out. He'll come back to earth some when Carlson returns.

Not even just Carlson. Their #1, #3, #4, #5, #6 defencemen in terms of total minutes played this season aren't with them at the moment due to either trades or injury. It's actually kinda wild. Their defence recently has been all minor leaguers + Sandin and TVR.

 

[herman]

He's currently enjoying more ice time with Carlson being out. He'll come back to earth some when Carlson returns.

Not even just Carlson. Their #1, #3, #4, #5, #6 defencemen in terms of total minutes played this season aren't with them at the moment due to either trades or injury. It's actually kinda wild. Their defence recently has been all minor leaguers + Sandin and TVR.

Hence Sandin playing AHL-level minutes. He'd often play half the game for the Marlies. Good for him!
With that ice time (and the forwards he now has access to), he generates enough offense on the scoresheet that Caps fans won't pay too much attention to how often he gets turnstiled or loses his man in DZ.

The Leafs replaced him with someone absolutely more reliable with cost control when Sandin's next contract is due during our projected cap hell season (new Matthews/Nylander + last year of Tavares/Marner), and also replaced his potential offense (and Rielly injury insurance) with a throw-in in Gustafsson, on top of getting an okay pick back in this year's draft.

Sure there's some asset loss in draft picks, but in a contention window, actual NHL-level bodies have far greater value than some hopeful maybes. Getting McCabe for 2.3 seasons at 50% off is a coup.

 

[cw]

Pierre Engvall Analysis Through 3 Games with Islanders
Right now the Islanders are having success when they keep things simple. So if Pierre Engvall is going to stick in the lineup, especially when players that know the system start returning from injury, he?s going to have to get a grip on the system soon, or he may be the odd man out with the Islanders having little to no room for error.

Engvall is not faring as well as Sandin filling in for injured players.
In 3GP, he's -3, no points, not much in miscellaneous stats or shots.

 

[yuzisee]

Connor Timmins has 7 less points in 30 less games.

? This is still the most important point.

Timmins' points-per-game is double Sandin's, and he's cheaper, and he signed early (i.e. didn't holdout for a contract). You don't need 3? d-men serving pure offence roles on a team, so keep two and maximize return on the third.

 

[Bill33]

I don't think comparing depth guys on small sample sizes in limited metrics is really the point.

Ultimately, I think Dubas had a logjam of current middle to low pairing defencemen, and with Sandin's draft pedigree and age, he was the easiest to move for an actual returning asset. It's nice to see that Sandin is getting minutes and doing well, because he wasn't going to get that opportunity on the leafs.

 

[cw]

Engvall scores his first for Islanders unassisted
Sandin assists for Capitals on goal to tie it up

 

[L K]

Engvall scores his first for Islanders unassisted
Sandin assists for Capitals on goal to tie it up

And then another goal and an assist for Sandin so his second three point night.  It's a hot streak but pretty impressive way to start with your new team.  2G 6A 8P in 4GP

 

[Guilt Trip]

Engvall scores his first for Islanders unassisted
Sandin assists for Capitals on goal to tie it up

And then another goal and an assist for Sandin so his second three point night.  It's a hot streak but pretty impressive way to start with your new team.  2G 6A 8P in 4GP

Happy for him and Engvall. Wish them well.

 

[cw]

Engvall scores his first for Islanders unassisted
Sandin assists for Capitals on goal to tie it up

And then another goal and an assist for Sandin so his second three point night.  It's a hot streak but pretty impressive way to start with your new team.  2G 6A 8P in 4GP

Here's one of his assists
https://twitter.com/Sportsnet/status/1634725669149065219

https://twitter.com/CapitalsPR/status/1634725984581632000

He's +6. It's getting almost silly now.

He's been on the ice for two goals against in those four games - neither of which he was at fault.

He is helping Washington crawl back into playoff contention.

 

[cw]

https://twitter.com/dalter/status/1634756801966092288

 

[ZBBM]

Engvall scores his first for Islanders unassisted
Sandin assists for Capitals on goal to tie it up

And then another goal and an assist for Sandin so his second three point night.  It's a hot streak but pretty impressive way to start with your new team.  2G 6A 8P in 4GP

Here's one of his assists
https://twitter.com/Sportsnet/status/1634725669149065219

https://twitter.com/CapitalsPR/status/1634725984581632000

He's +6. It's getting almost silly now.

He's been on the ice for two goals against in those four games - neither of which he was at fault.

He is helping Washington crawl back into playoff contention.

Until he cools off folks might be advised to quit tryying to portray this as some kind of shrewd trade.

 

[ZBBM]

https://twitter.com/dalter/status/1634756801966092288

Put the baby in a stick bag and get the fam on a flight.  The kid needs to learn from the get-go that he/she/they is a Leaf.  It's the crest on the front, not the name on the bassinet.

 

[cw]

https://twitter.com/dalter/status/1634756801966092288

Put the baby in a stick bag and get the fam on a flight.  The kid needs to learn from the get-go that he/she/they is a Leaf.  It's the crest on the front, not the name on the bassinet.

From the way Keefe expressed it, sounds like he'll be here very soon. Baby came Friday. They were home packing up, etc. Good chance he'll be here for Buffalo on Monday. I'd say definitely for Colorado on Wednesday.

Holl's total ice time for tonight was 13:48, Gustavsson 13:55, Liljegren 12:18.

That's ice time Schenn could handle.

Maybe that's part of the thinking behind the 11-7 ...

 

[cw]

https://twitter.com/CapitalsPR/status/1633496125968711680

https://twitter.com/CapitalsPR/status/1634763397576130562

https://twitter.com/StatsCentre/status/1634754340257775617

The Capital players have their fathers with them.
So Sandin's father was witnessing this.
Nice story. Good for him.

 

[Bender]

https://twitter.com/CapitalsPR/status/1633496125968711680

https://twitter.com/CapitalsPR/status/1634763397576130562

https://twitter.com/StatsCentre/status/1634754340257775617

The Capital players have their fathers with them.
So Sandin's father with witnessing this.
Nice story. Good for him.

Good for him, also very Leafian lol.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

https://twitter.com/TomGulittiNHL/status/1637538009074614272

The hockey gods are very, very cruel. There was no way they were going to just let Sandin get away with a 20% on-ice shooting percentage in his first 4 games as a Cap without some swift pay back.