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2012 Toronto Blue Jays Thread

Blech.  Hard to not be thoroughly annoyed about this.  It's not that Farrell was great, it's that Boston just came in and basically took what they wanted.  The word "pushovers" isn't leaving my mind right now. Sure if Farrell wanted to go maybe you need to cut bait and avoid having a miserable manager, but that doesn't really help make one feel better about the situation. 

I think maybe the key thing about a good manager is simply stability. A quality person who gets the game, knows how to handle his players and is around for a while.  The Jays haven't really had it since Cito's first run.  The  slow moving revolving door needs to stop.
 
bustaheims said:
He's a replacement level guy, though he's shown signs of being a plus defender.
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I'm not sure that's entirely fair. He's hit well before this year and, like you say. has had some pretty remarkable defensive years at SS. He's not a sure thing, no, but there's some upside there.
 
Nik V. Debs said:
I'm not sure that's entirely fair. He's hit well before this year and, like you say. has had some pretty remarkable defensive years at SS. He's not a sure thing, no, but there's some upside there.
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He's had one season where I'd say he hit noticeably better than a replacement quality guy - and that was his rookie season. At 32, I'm not sure how much upside there is left in him. I'd say the odds are that he's at or near his ceiling. His defence really depends on where the Jays use him. He's been pretty good at SS, though, he'd still be a downgrade on Escobar, while he's been pretty average at 2B - which would put him roughly on par with Johnson, but with less production at the plate. His numbers against AL East opponents are also not good. On a contending team, he's a bench player.
 
I hear another player is going over the the Sox. Maybe McCoy? Yeah, I'm not all that excited about this but I didn't expect to be.
 
bustaheims said:
He's had one season where I'd say he hit noticeably better than a replacement quality guy - and that was his rookie season.
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Well, that's not really true. He had a 2.1 oWAR as a second basemen, which is a better hitting position then at short for one but it's still two full wins above replacement which is a reasonably good starter if he can marry it with decent defense.

So it's two years and, really, before last year those were the only two years where he got anything resembling a full season of work so there is evidence that if you play him at SS and you leave him in the lineup that he can both defend the position and hit a bit.
 
The Sarge said:
I hear another player is going over the the Sox. Maybe McCoy? Yeah, I'm not all that excited about this but I didn't expect to be.
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Right now I'm far more interested in who they are considering for Manager.

I saw Sandy Alomar Jr.'s name float by on twitter this morning. I think he was in consideration back when they hired Farrell, no?

Who is this year's Buck Showalter?
 
Corn Flake said:
Who is this year's Buck Showalter?
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I don't think there's anyone like that around, someone with a proven track record in the game and known to be looking for a job, but there are some big time candidates.

Personally, the two guys I'd look the hardest at are Brad Ausmus and Dave Martinez. Ausmus because he's the guy everyone is talking about as being the big time managing prospect and Martinez because the Jays are going to need some of what is going on in Tampa.
 
I'd look at Fasano too but maybe he's not quite ready yet. By most accounts, he's going to be a very good big league manager one day.
 
bustaheims said:
GordonEdes: Adam Lind is not part of deal with Toronto, a baseball source said, putting that speculation to rest.
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That's disappointing. Lind is a guy who I think they need to dump as AA has some holes that need filling and MLB free agency is really, really expensive, even with a raise in payroll. He's also, you know, a useless and terrible 1B. I understand that it was wishful thinking to hope that the Jays could get some good in return for Farrell, but I'm a little surprised they couldn't talk the Sox into eating Lind's contract.
 
OFFICIAL: @RedSox agree to 3-year contract with manager John Farrell. INF Mike Aviles goes to @BlueJays in trade for RHP David Carpenter.
 
Not on common ground...

http://www.sportsnet.ca/baseball/2012/10/23/farrell_and_anthopoulos_from_different_planets/

In my relationship with Alex, and the conversations we would have regarding the roster,? Farrell said, ?there might have been opportunities for me to speak more passionately toward some suggestions or recommendations to the roster.?

It also raises doubts about Farrell?s ability to effectively communicate some things people suggest have bothered him over the past year, such as the club?s failure to add veteran starting pitching last off-season, the decision to recall Anthony Gose over Travis Snider in July, the failure to acquire an available starter such as Jeremy Guthrie mid-season, and being told not to sit shortstop Yunel Escobar in favour of rookie Adeiny Hechavarria late in the season.

There is also some debate whether Farrell warned Anthopoulos in the weeks before the July 31 non-waiver trade deadline that the failure to add a significant player would badly deflate the clubhouse.

...once the deadline passed with only relievers Brad Lincoln and Steve Delabar added, Farrell became so concerned with the team?s morale he held a meeting with five of the team?s core players during a series in Seattle to reiterate that a white flag hadn?t been raised on the season.

The talk didn?t help, as a feeling the plug had been pulled, combined with a run of injuries led to a 9-19 nosedive in August.

Communication issues were also part of the criticisms levelled at Farrell and the coaching staff by Omar Vizquel to the Toronto Sun during the final week of the season. That led to a team meeting in which Farrell apparently told players that complaints about his work should be brought to the manager?s office, and he criticized the veteran infielder for throwing a hard-working and devoted staff under the bus.

?This city and organization holds a special place to me and my family, for a set of experiences and a family situation,? said Farrell.

"A lot has been made, and blown out of proportion to be quite frank with you, that Alex and I had a disconnect and that we didn?t see eye-to-eye,? said Farrell. ?We?re two competitive people in a competitive environment, you?re going to have different opinions and we were hit with a lot of different challenges, from injury to certain performances.

 
Corn Flake said:
@LottOnBaseball AA: JF told him he wanted to pursue "dream job" in Boston right after season, even before Boston called.

>:(
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I think this has been disputed in other stories where, if memory serves, Farrell had indicated that Boston was his preferred destination last year.  Doesn't change the >:( in any way, however, and in fact probably makes it worse.
 
James Mirtle ‏@mirtle
Rogers says it's lost about $8-million on the Leafs and MLSE after three months of ownership: http://bit.ly/WJ6m6E

So, any reasonable expectation the Jays are going to spend big this winter? Ugh.
 
The Sarge said:
James Mirtle ‏@mirtle
Rogers says it's lost about $8-million on the Leafs and MLSE after three months of ownership: http://bit.ly/WJ6m6E

So, any reasonable expectation the Jays are going to spend big this winter? Ugh.
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That 8 million represents about 1 half of 1 percent of Rogers net profit in 2011.
 
Deebo said:
The Sarge said:
James Mirtle ‏@mirtle
Rogers says it's lost about $8-million on the Leafs and MLSE after three months of ownership: http://bit.ly/WJ6m6E

So, any reasonable expectation the Jays are going to spend big this winter? Ugh.
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That 8 million represents about 1 half of 1 percent of Rogers net profit in 2011.
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... and counting. I don't know, I'd feel more comfortable as a fan if my owners were making money as opposed to losing it. Wouldn't you? 
 
The Sarge said:
... and counting. I don't know, I'd feel more comfortable as a fan if my owners were making money as opposed to losing it. Wouldn't you?
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But Rogers is making money. There's no reason to think that the Leafs not making money, and let's be real with ourselves for a second and realize that the Leafs are on pretty solid financial ground, will affect the Jays at all.
 
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