2013 Toronto Blue Jays Thread

[Chev-boyar-sky]

Let's judge it on 2 starts, that makes sense.

His April stats last season were noticeably worse than the rest of his season, too.

Worse as in as bad as this season or just not elite? I mean the worrying thing is that he has elite career numbers in the NL and horrific career numbers in the AL.

Let's hope his numbers in the NL are the "real" R.A> Dickey and not his AL numbers.

There's legitimate reason for concern IMO.

 

[#1PilarFan]

It makes at least as much sense as hyping a team that hadn't even played a game.

Excitement for what looks like a legitimate playoff team is not the same as complaining about the reigning NL Cy Young winner after 9 innings pitched.

 

[maplesyrup]

Verlander, Strasburg, Cueto all off to bad starts this afternoon. I think all three teams and their fans should panic.

 

[#1PilarFan]

Worse as in as bad as this season or just not elite. I mean the worrying thing is that he has elite career numbers in the NL and horrific career numbers in the AL.

Let's hope his numbers in the NL are the "real" R.A> Dickey and not his AL numbers.

There's legitimate reason for concern IMO.

There's concern that maybe the Jays paid too much at the wrong time, but you really need to put some context into Dickey's career numbers. The majority of his time spent in the AL, he was not throwing a knuckleball.

 

[Chev-boyar-sky]

Verlander, Strasburg, Customer all off to bad starts this afternoon. I think all three teams and their fans should panic.

I mean, really? Verlander already pitched a 5 inning shutout for a win (Strasburg same thing over 7) . Dickey got hammered and has done so again in his second start. These things are equatable how?

 

[maplesyrup]

Verlander, Strasburg, Customer all off to bad starts this afternoon. I think all three teams and their fans should panic.

I mean, really? Verlander already pitched a 5 inning shutout for a win (Strasburg same thing over 7) . Dickey got hammered and has done so again in his second start. These things are equatable how?

They're are equitable because 2 starts shows you little to nothing more than 1.

 

[TML fan]

It makes at least as much sense as hyping a team that hadn't even played a game.

Excitement for what looks like a legitimate playoff team is not the same as complaining about the reigning NL Cy Young winner after 9 innings pitched.

You're right. Dickey has actually played a game.

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

Let's judge it on 2 starts, that makes sense.

His April stats last season were noticeably worse than the rest of his season, too.

Worse as in as bad as this season or just not elite? I mean the worrying thing is that he has elite career numbers in the NL and horrific career numbers in the AL.

Let's hope his numbers in the NL are the "real" R.A> Dickey and not his AL numbers.

There's legitimate reason for concern IMO.

But he wasn't throwing the knuckleball in the AL (or he was just starting to) so it's unfair to compare his AL numbers to his NL numbers.  They are basically two different pitchers.

EDIT: And his April ERA last season was 4.45 with 10 BB & 7 HR allowed.  The rest of the way it was 2.48.  That April also included a 4.1 IP, 8 ER game.  He didn't allow more than 5 runs in a game the rest of the season.

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

Verlander, Strasburg, Customer all off to bad starts this afternoon. I think all three teams and their fans should panic.

I mean, really? Verlander already pitched a 5 inning shutout for a win (Strasburg same thing over 7) . Dickey got hammered and has done so again in his second start. These things are equatable how?

Didn't really get hammered did he? 3 earned runs isn't a great start, but not the worst end of the spectrum.

 

[maplesyrup]

Sorry, meant to type Cueto there... Stupid autocorrect. - Fixed.

 

[Chev-boyar-sky]

Verlander, Strasburg, Customer all off to bad starts this afternoon. I think all three teams and their fans should panic.

I mean, really? Verlander already pitched a 5 inning shutout for a win (Strasburg same thing over 7) . Dickey got hammered and has done so again in his second start. These things are equatable how?

Didn't really get hammered did he? 3 earned runs isn't a great start, but not the worst end of the spectrum.

8 R with ONLY 7 ER in 4 IP? Only 1 BB? Yeah I'll stick with hammered...

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

Red Sox BABIP vs. Dickey is .563 through 4 innings.  Last season the BABIP for Dickey was .280, and in his first start was .222.  This is an outlier.

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

Verlander, Strasburg, Customer all off to bad starts this afternoon. I think all three teams and their fans should panic.

I mean, really? Verlander already pitched a 5 inning shutout for a win (Strasburg same thing over 7) . Dickey got hammered and has done so again in his second start. These things are equatable how?

Didn't really get hammered did he? 3 earned runs isn't a great start, but not the worst end of the spectrum.

8 R with ONLY 7 ER in 4 IP? Only 1 BB? Yeah I'll stick with hammered...

If you will refer to your original post, you used hammered to refer to his first start, in which Dickey allowed 3 ER, so I also was referring to his first start.

 

[#1PilarFan]

8 R with ONLY 7 ER in 4 IP? Only 1 BB? Yeah I'll stick with hammered...

I think he's referring to the Dickey's first start, where he pitched 6 innings and allowed 3ER. That's not what we traded for, but that's no one's definition of getting "hammered".

 

[Chev-boyar-sky]

Red Sox BABIP vs. Dickey is .563 through 4 innings.  Last season the BABIP for Dickey was .280, and in his first start was .222.  This is an outlier.

Ok, on one hand he's not this bad, but his career numbers and history tell us pitching in the AL is a fair bit harder than in the NL.

So far that bit of wisdom is holding true.

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

Red Sox BABIP vs. Dickey is .563 through 4 innings.  Last season the BABIP for Dickey was .280, and in his first start was .222.  This is an outlier.

Ok, on one hand he's not this bad, but his career numbers and history tell us pitching in the AL is a fair bit harder than in the NL.

So far that bit of wisdom is holding true.

But he also got "hammered" in some of his early NL starts last season too.

The point is, it's too early to come to any conclusions about Dickey, and there's no point over-reacting to single outings in a long season.

 

[Kin]

Red Sox BABIP vs. Dickey is .563 through 4 innings.  Last season the BABIP for Dickey was .280, and in his first start was .222.  This is an outlier.

You're misusing BABIP a little. It's really meant as more of a stat to take in large sample sizes with the assumption that a deviation from the norm is attributable to luck/defense. In a one day sense a bad BABIP can just mean a pitcher is pitching poorly.

Besides, his walk rate/HR allowed aren't so his defense independent numbers would be lousy anyway.

 

[Kin]

It's obviously not something to draw a conclusion from yet but it'd be interesting if the Red Sox were a team that consistently hit Dickey well being as John Farrell has a good deal of experience coaching Tim Wakefield.

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

Red Sox BABIP vs. Dickey is .563 through 4 innings.  Last season the BABIP for Dickey was .280, and in his first start was .222.  This is an outlier.

You're misusing BABIP a little. It's really meant as more of a stat to take in large sample sizes with the assumption that a deviation from the norm is attributable to luck/defense. In a one day sense a bad BABIP can just mean a pitcher is pitching poorly.

Besides, his walk rate/HR allowed aren't so his defense independent numbers would be lousy anyway.

Oh I'm aware of that.  I think the point still stands that this is not something that will continue, so no point drawing too many conclusions from it.

 

[Kin]

Oh I'm aware of that.  I think the point still stands that this is not something that will continue, so no point drawing too many conclusions from it.

Well, I agree that you can't read too much into one start but I don't know if we should just point to last year as evidence of what will or won't happen this year. Beyond the basic year to year inconsistencies that can hit pitchers there are, I think we can agree, more question marks surrounding Dickey than most.