2019 Toronto Maple Leafs Offseason Discussion

[WhatIfGodWasALeaf]

I wonder if they consider walking from any award and giving the money to Gardiner.

We know Jake wants to stay and would give him the chance to put the back doubt behind him.

Of course with that back he might be looking for term and security, so who knows?

 

[Guilt Trip]

I wonder if they consider walking from any award and giving the money to Gardiner.

We know Jake wants to stay and would give him the chance to put the back doubt behind him.

Of course with that back he might be looking for term and security, so who knows?

You have to think that Jake wants more then Myers so 6+ mill. With Dubas saying Ceci is going to arb, I wonder if the Leafs will walk?

 

[WhatIfGodWasALeaf]

That would be a reasonable assumption.

But could you convince him to come back on a one year deal for similar money to Reilly?

Let?s him pump his tires for next summer where he could get the big payday if he proves the back isn?t an issue.

Probably not, just wondering.

 

[ZBBM]

Barrie has made Gardiner redundant.

 

[Bullfrog]

Barrie has made Gardiner redundant.

Somewhat. Gardiner is demonstrably better defensively.

 

[Guilt Trip]

Barrie has made Gardiner redundant.

Somewhat. Gardiner is demonstrably better defensively.

We'll see.

 

[herman]

Interesting segment from Chris Johnston on the Steve Dangle Podcast.

https://twitter.com/account4hockey/status/1146275730252271616
Thread

 

[Bender]

Interesting segment from Chris Johnston on the Steve Dangle Podcast.

https://twitter.com/account4hockey/status/1146275730252271616
Thread

I had a feeling there was something there. Gards would easily sign with any other offer if he really wanted to. I think he's waiting to see how things shake out with the Leafs and if it can work.

And to add, they're really that strongly pro Ceci? I mean I know you have him only for a year but he has an arb case coming up and if it's north of $4.5m how do you not walk away from that?

 

[CarltonTheBear]

I doubt 6x6 would be a "discount" for Gardiner anymore. If he was being offered $7mil long-term he'd have taken it by now.

 

[Kin]

Admittedly I'm not a doctor and haven't seen any medical stuff but I'm really having trouble with the idea that NHL teams, who are usually so very smart and cautious with free agents, look at a guy like Gardiner who's been one of the healthiest guys in the league for 6 years or so missing 20 games with an injury and decide he's basically done.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

Admittedly I'm not a doctor and haven't seen any medical stuff but I'm really having trouble with the idea that NHL teams, who are usually so very smart and cautious with free agents, look at a guy like Gardiner who's been one of the healthiest guys in the league for 6 years or so missing 20 games with an injury and decide he's basically done.

I think he's unsigned right now, and not getting a massive contract when he does, more because traditional hockey people still think he's "bad" defensively.

 

[Bender]

Admittedly I'm not a doctor and haven't seen any medical stuff but I'm really having trouble with the idea that NHL teams, who are usually so very smart and cautious with free agents, look at a guy like Gardiner who's been one of the healthiest guys in the league for 6 years or so missing 20 games with an injury and decide he's basically done.

Yeah, I don't think he's basically done, but I think it's possible they feel that a back injury isn't one that can heal as easily/straightforwardly as say a broken arm or something. Who's to say the back spasms don't happen again and severely diminish what he brings? I wonder what kind of evaluation process that is.

 

[Kin]

Admittedly I'm not a doctor and haven't seen any medical stuff but I'm really having trouble with the idea that NHL teams, who are usually so very smart and cautious with free agents, look at a guy like Gardiner who's been one of the healthiest guys in the league for 6 years or so missing 20 games with an injury and decide he's basically done.

I think he's unsigned right now, and not getting a massive contract when he does, more because traditional hockey people still think he's "bad" defensively.

Yeah, that seems more legit. I also think, and this is just based on my own observations, that his real trouble is that he's not traditionally good defensively but he's also not great offensively in terms of being a point producer. He had a couple of years with big assist numbers once the Leafs were chock full of offensive talent but in a neutral context he's a good puck mover who isn't a great penalty killer and can probably be depended on for 30-40 points.

I think that can be a valuable player but I'm not sure it's worth 7+ million.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

I was looking through which teams would have the cap space/need for Gardiner and New Jersey jumped out pretty quickly. They have $20mil in cap space currently and no big-money RFAs to re-sign. They obviously have to be careful in the future with Hall being an UFA next summer but they'll still have plenty of space. Their entire left side defence looks brutal with Andy Greene turning 37 years old this October and being a shadow of his former self. They were an awful possession team last season. And while they've always seemed like an analytics-friendly team post-Lou they made two pretty huge (relatively speaking) analytics hires this summer with Tyler Dellow and Matt Cane. Seems like a perfect fit. Gardiner and Subban would completely change their defence there.

 

[ZBBM]

If the only thing standing between signing Gardiner at a discount is Cody Ceci then I say all the worse for Cody Ceci.

 

[slapshot]

I would be surprised if Gardiner were back, as I think most people would be. I think his ship has sailed. He want long term and I don't think the Leafs are prepared to gamble with that any more than they were with Kadri. I think they'd like to see what they have in Ceci, maybe get his game improved. A two-year deal might be best as they already have Barrie and Muzzin expiring next year.  Plus I think Ceci might be willing to take a bit less, if he were offered two years instead of one. If he were a lefty I'd say one year, but as a righty he's probably of more value at the moment.

 

[Zee]

It would take a hell of a discount, or some other roster move to see Gardiner back on this team.  I get that he wants to be here, but at what cost to him?  Are the Leafs the only team willing to risk his back injury being ok?  Does he take a 1 year "prove it" deal to show everyone he's 100% healthy?

 

[CarltonTheBear]

It would take a hell of a discount, or some other roster move to see Gardiner back on this team.  I get that he wants to be here, but at what cost to him?  Are the Leafs the only team willing to risk his back injury being ok?  Does he take a 1 year "prove it" deal to show everyone he's 100% healthy?

I'm not saying that there's definitely no chance of this happening, but if it does Gardiner has to know that he's probably not going to get much if any powerplay time now with Rielly and Barrie ahead of him. So he'd be going into next years free agency market potentially proving that he's healthy but also maybe coming off his worst offensive season in years.

 

[Kin]

I appreciate that the Leafs haven't had a ton of post-season success yet and for some people that's all that would justify such a decision but the idea of someone like Gardiner taking a below market deal to stay with a contender in a city he likes isn't some sort of crazy nonsense to be dismissed as unheard of fantasy.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

Can the Leafs still offer him an 8-year deal, or did that expire on July 1st? I always wondered about the possibility of that. Heavily front-loaded with signing bonuses and a surprisingly low AAV.