• For users coming over from tmlfans.ca your username will remain the same but you will need to use the password reset feature (check your spam folder) on the login page in order to set your password. If you encounter issues, email Rick couchmanrick@gmail.com

Men's Olympic hockey

Potvin29 said:
RedLeaf said:
Man it would have been special to see Stamkos and Crosby together.
Click to expand...

Would have been scary, IMO.  Would be the best player Crosby's ever played with probably.
Click to expand...

I have no doubt we'll see them play together at some point. Probably at the next World Cup, as I'm starting to think this will be the last time the NHL sends players to the Olympics.
 
Guru Tugginmypuddah said:
Kessel 1G 2A
JVR 2A
Click to expand...

Loved the back-handed sided drop back Kessel fed Carlson going down the wing deep into the Slovenia zone, and Carlson banging it away.
Almost found myself cheering for Team USA (while forgetting that hey, I'm Canadian).  :D
 
Potvin29 said:
But isn't almost every player on the team adjusting to a new role?  Isn't that inherently what this tournament is about?  Kunitz is going to be adjusting to facing consistently tougher competition and adjusting to big ice too.  A guy like Giroux on Crosby's wing is so, so, so much better IMO.  I mean, Crosby has a 51 goal season, he can feed off another playmaker.  These guys are great, great players which means they don't need to be pigeon-holed into one style of play.  Crosby played a season where Malkin was his most common linemate and scored at a higher rate than without him.

I still think it's a silly notion, and that Kunitz is going to have to adjust to the Olympics as much as a guy like Giroux would have to adjust to Crosby and that in the end I think it will negate any benefit to bringing him.
Click to expand...

Are they really, though? I mean, these are already guys that are used to playing against the best players on the opposing teams. Sure, they'll have to raise their game a little because, in some cases, the quality of the best players on the teams they'll be facing is a little higher, but, for the most part, other than guys that are now adjusting to defence-first roles, they're being used in pretty much in the same way they would be in the NHL. They're adjusting to new line mates, but, there aren't a lot of guys that are used to being the guy who creates the play being asked to be the guy who finished the play and vice versa. There aren't a lot of centres being asked to play wing or wingers being asked to play centre (which is something a lot of people are looking to do with their suggestions). The way the team has been put together has minimized the amount of adjusting the players on the team need to make in a short period. If this was a more prolonged tournament, I'd absolutely be on board with you, but, as I said, this is a 10 day tournament. There isn't time for lots of adjustments or experiments.

And, as Nik pointed out, this isn't about whether or not Crosby will be effective. He almost certainly will be. It's whether or not his linemates will be, and that was a bit of an issue in Vancouver.
 
Wha? My CBC mobile app is very pretty, but doesn't play any events, just a black screen. That's a huge dissappointment. Well done fellas.

NBC wants a subscription/membership on their site.
 
Mostar said:
Wha? My CBC mobile app is very pretty, but doesn't play any events, just a black screen. That's a huge dissappointment. Well done fellas.

NBC wants a subscription/membership on their site.
Click to expand...

Could be a flash issue.
 
Speaking of making adjustments, the biggest obstacle to overcome for most of these players has to be the rink size. It changes the dynamics of the play for those unaccustomed to it.

I remember reading somewhere, and (I think it was Komorav??) that said it takes most Europeans coming over to NA, 2-3 months to completely make the adjustment. To expect the NA players to feel comfortable (when that's reversed) in just a few days is a challenge, even for those that have played on the bigger sheet for tournaments in the past. Whether that has been the reason Canada and USA have better records on this side of the pond remains to be seen I guess.
 
bustaheims said:
Potvin29 said:
But isn't almost every player on the team adjusting to a new role?  Isn't that inherently what this tournament is about?  Kunitz is going to be adjusting to facing consistently tougher competition and adjusting to big ice too.  A guy like Giroux on Crosby's wing is so, so, so much better IMO.  I mean, Crosby has a 51 goal season, he can feed off another playmaker.  These guys are great, great players which means they don't need to be pigeon-holed into one style of play.  Crosby played a season where Malkin was his most common linemate and scored at a higher rate than without him.

I still think it's a silly notion, and that Kunitz is going to have to adjust to the Olympics as much as a guy like Giroux would have to adjust to Crosby and that in the end I think it will negate any benefit to bringing him.
Click to expand...

Are they really, though? I mean, these are already guys that are used to playing against the best players on the opposing teams. Sure, they'll have to raise their game a little because, in some cases, the quality of the best players on the teams they'll be facing is a little higher, but, for the most part, other than guys that are now adjusting to defence-first roles, they're being used in pretty much in the same way they would be in the NHL. They're adjusting to new line mates, but, there aren't a lot of guys that are used to being the guy who creates the play being asked to be the guy who finished the play and vice versa. There aren't a lot of centres being asked to play wing or wingers being asked to play centre (which is something a lot of people are looking to do with their suggestions). The way the team has been put together has minimized the amount of adjusting the players on the team need to make in a short period. If this was a more prolonged tournament, I'd absolutely be on board with you, but, as I said, this is a 10 day tournament. There isn't time for lots of adjustments or experiments.
Click to expand...

They're all adjusting to the bigger ice too, and I just think a better overall player would be a better option than Kunitz.  I think he'll struggle to make the adjustments more than a player who is a legitimate Olympian on his own without playing with Crosby.  Wouldn't it have made sense to take Seabrook-Keith then?  I feel like on D having a familiar partner is more important - but they seem to have in some cases chosen a familiar player and in some cases not.  I don't know why.

But we'll have to agree to disagree, mostly because I am out of arguments. 
 
RedLeaf said:
Speaking of making adjustments, the biggest obstacle to overcome for most of these players has to be the rink size. It changes the dynamics of the play for those unaccustomed to it.

I remember reading somewhere, and (I think it was Komorav??) that said it takes most Europeans coming over to NA, 2-3 months to completely make the adjustment. To expect the NA players to feel comfortable (when that's reversed) in just a few days is a challenge, even for those that have played on the bigger sheet for tournaments in the past. Whether that has been the reason Canada and USA have better records on this side of the pond remains to be seen I guess.
Click to expand...

Jesse Winchester had some great comments on the ice size in Elliotte Friendman's most recent 30 Thoughts:

SYSTEMS: ?Based on my experience overseas, most teams I encountered used a neutral zone trap to negate the speed with which their opponents were able to attack?It took some getting used to, only because in the NHL so many systems attack aggressively in all three zones and use the boards as a battle ground to gain possession. The trap can be frustrating as it keeps lesser-talented teams in games longer, so it's important for our boys to stay the course. Cliche, yes, but it will pay off.?

MIKE BABCOCK?S WAY: ?Babcock's coaching philosophy in Detroit seems to highlight the importance of puck possession versus chasing pucks down so I wouldn't expect to see much change in Canada's approach. Like Zetterberg and Datsyuk attack teams through the middle, I expect to see the same things from Canada given our depth at that position. Honestly, I'm excited to see the first time that we break through the neutral zone cleanly with Crosby at full speed and a few extra feet of space to manoeuvre- could be scary!?

PENALTY-KILLING: ?As a player who relishes that type of role I can assure you that my approach to killing changed dramatically because of the extra space in-zone. I expect most of the contenders to play a system with a very tight box, forcing less, and relying more on staying tight as to limit plays through the center of the box. Again, this is in contrast to how we do it on the smaller ice. There are far fewer opportunities to force the opposition into making a rushed play because the extra length it takes to enforce that read can get you so far out of position and into a situation where you are unable to recover. Therefore, there will be times where penalty kill will be in limbo because killers will want to force a play but are forced instead to stay patient and rely on the system more so than instinct.?

POWER PLAY: ?Our PP will not feel pressured the way they are in the NHL, but teams will be very tight around the net...our big men will have to be brilliant around the paint, especially as the tournament drags on.
Click to expand...

http://olympics.cbc.ca/blogs/author/elliotte-friedman/article/thoughts-keys-olympic-hockey-success.html
 
Without having watched the game, I have to say I was kind of expecting more than a 3-1 outcome from Canada.
 
bustaheims said:
And, as Nik pointed out, this isn't about whether or not Crosby will be effective. He almost certainly will be. It's whether or not his linemates will be, and that was a bit of an issue in Vancouver.
Click to expand...

Also there is something to be said for it affecting Crosby's performance too. I know there's a sense among some statistically inclined people to look at a player, see that they registered a point per game over a stretch and declare him as having been effective in that stretch but even the most cursory closer look at Crosby's 2010 reveals him to have had a tournament that is pretty below par for him even when taking into consideration the higher level of competition they faced.

Crosby ended the tournament with 7 points in 7 games but three of those points were assists in the 8-0 victory over Norway. That's not in and of itself a bad thing but when you consider that Sidney Crosby is probably the most gifted passer in the world and those three assists were all of his assists in the tournament?

Crosby four goals included being credited with a goal for his shootout goal against Switzerland, a goal against Germany when the game was largely over, a goal in the loss to America where Crosby was on the ice for most of the goals against and the gold medal winner which represented his lone point, not goal but point, in the elimination round. Nothing against Russia, Nothing against the Slovaks in the Semis and then pointless until it went to 4 on 4 in the gold medal game.

Again, we're talking about a guy who, I think by most accounts, is the best player in the world and who represent a major strength for team Canada. Him being "ok" is a pretty bad result that any competent GM would try to address. The memory of his line being ineffective during that tournament is a pretty direct result of the fact that they essentially got nothing done in the three most important games the team played.
 
So from what I've seen so far, and obviously that's only one game, I'd put my medal predictions as:

Gold: USA
Silver: Canada
Bronze: Sweden*

I think Canada v USA would come down to a 1 goal game and I think USA has better depth in scoring and Quick looked superb today. Russia didn't really impress me, but the home advantage is bound to count. Sweden are just an efficient team and gel quickly.


*If Zetterberg is out, make this Russia
 
Next game I would try

Duchene - Crosby - Bergeron
Benn - Tavares - Carter
 
Guru Tugginmypuddah said:
Mostar said:
Wha? My CBC mobile app is very pretty, but doesn't play any events, just a black screen. That's a huge dissappointment. Well done fellas.

NBC wants a subscription/membership on their site.
Click to expand...

Could be a flash issue.
Click to expand...

Thanks...I just needed to try it a few times and it worked.
 
Great Zetterberg is hurt too. I hear that Berglund will wear the C now.

Edit. Actually Kronwall will wear the C, makes more sense.
 
Potvin29 said:
RedLeaf said:
Man it would have been special to see Stamkos and Crosby together.
Click to expand...

Would have been scary, IMO.  Would be the best player Crosby's ever played with probably.
Click to expand...
Sorry, I'm a little late to comment on this, but you really would argue that Stamkos is better than Malkin? A better goal scorer perhaps... but better player?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

About Us

This website is NOT associated with the Toronto Maple Leafs or the NHL.


It is operated by Rick Couchman and Jeff Lewis.
Back
Top