Randy Carlyle/Leaf Coach thread

[bbt]

Agree.  Poor leadership on the bench and on the ice. 

 

[Heroic Shrimp]

Jonas Siegel ‏@jonasTSN1050 3m
Carlyle wasn't pleased by opposing coach's perception of Leafs as rush team: "...is that what we are? We don?t want to be that."

It's amazing how often Carlyle can leave me speechless.

Maybe he's just saying that he's not happy with there being so little of the "everything else" that it inevitably defines his team as a rushing team??

 

[Bullfrog]

I can't help but see a hole in the leadership department, and I'm not pointing specifically at Phaneuf. There should be 2 or 3 guys (+coaching) that keeps the team motivated and playing hard a lot more than the Leafs have shown.

This has been a big concern for me over the last couple years, too.  Phaneuf doesn't lead much outside of laying down some big hits.  Clarkson was not the answer, either.

As much as I have concerns with his contract, Clarkson really is the type of player this team needs. Aside from him and Kulemin, there's really very little toughness amongst our skilled forwards.

 

[Corn Flake]

Geez are we at the bottom of the standings again?


Oh we're not?

 

[Stickytape]

I can't help but see a hole in the leadership department, and I'm not pointing specifically at Phaneuf. There should be 2 or 3 guys (+coaching) that keeps the team motivated and playing hard a lot more than the Leafs have shown.

This has been a big concern for me over the last couple years, too.  Phaneuf doesn't lead much outside of laying down some big hits.  Clarkson was not the answer, either.

As much as I have concerns with his contract, Clarkson really is the type of player this team needs. Aside from him and Kulemin, there's really very little toughness amongst our skilled forwards.

Don't get me wrong, I feel this way too.  I just don't think he's the answer to the team's leadership needs.  It's great to have guys out there with energy, but that's just one facet of leadership.

 

[bustaheims]

Geez are we at the bottom of the standings again?


Oh we're not?

The way they've played the past few weeks, just give it a little time and they'll be there.

 

[princedpw]

Geez are we at the bottom of the standings again?


Oh we're not?

The way they've played the past few weeks, just give it a little time and they'll be there.

Buffalo is the worst team in the league and we split with them.  Columbus is a bad team and they were missing 3 of their top forwards.  We were demolished by them. 

Right now, outside of the goaltenders, I think there is quite a legit argument that we are playing like we are the worst team in the league.

 

[Kin]

Buffalo is the worst team in the league and we split with them.  Columbus is a bad team and they were missing 3 of their top forwards.  We were demolished by them. 

Columbus, bad team and injury riddled, still started the reigning Vezina trophy winner. Buffalo only has five wins all year but that includes wins over the 15-3-5 Sharks and 16-6-3 Kings.

The idea that anyone is a pushover in this league or that a loss, to anyone, is indicative of something deeper just doesn't hold water these days if it ever did. That's what parity is.

Although, even with all that said, I would say that "The Leafs always bring it against the good teams but have trouble bringing that same energy against easy teams" is a charge that has been leveled at them basically every single year I've been a Leafs fan.

 

[hockeyfan1]

Buffalo is the worst team in the league and we split with them.  Columbus is a bad team and they were missing 3 of their top forwards.  We were demolished by them. 
A

Although, even with all that said, I would say that "The Leafs always bring it against the good teams but have trouble bringing that same energy against easy teams" is a charge that has been leveled at them basically every single year I've been a Leafs fan.

That has been the case for so long now, I've lost count.  Throughout Leaf history, they've demonstrated this aspect of their play.  But that's just the way the Leafs are and doesn't like look that will change.

 

[OldTimeHockey]

A charge like that doesn't fall solely on the Leafs. Throughout history many teams in many sports have a hard time bringing it against the weak(er) teams. I think it's simply human nature.

 

[TML fan]

Is he fired yet?

 

[Arn]

Shouldn't even be allowed off the bench in Pittsburgh.

 

[Kin]

I feel like tonight perfectly encapsulated what I find a little strange about all of the Carlyle criticism. I mean, I can count shots on net as well as the next person but I still struggle with the idea that what the team is producing is wildly out of step with the talent level of the club.

Admittedly, I claim no expertise in the area of the Xs and Os and I'm not an advocate of the face punchers, but I still have to come back to the idea that how a coach coaches is secondary to the talent level on a club and where this team is record wise, to me, is reflective of a not very good team that's gotten really good goaltending but caught some bad breaks injury wise.

 

[Strangelove]

His team gets destroyed in every facet of the game night after night. Why there aren't even whispers in the media about his poor decision-making is beyond me.

For him, guys like Jay McClement and David Clarkson, no matter how obviously poorly they're playing, can do no wrong.  Holland has a bad shift and he's literally benched for the rest of the night.

There are about a million good reasons why he should be fired as soon as possible. Let's see if Nonis has the cajones to do it.

 

[Spider]

When is Ron Wilson coming back, I'd rather have him.  0 shots on a minor league goalie for a whole period, is embarrassing...

 

[CarltonTheBear]

Admittedly, I claim no expertise in the area of the Xs and Os and I'm not an advocate of the face punchers, but I still have to come back to the idea that how a coach coaches is secondary to the talent level on a club and where this team is record wise, to me, is reflective of a not very good team that's gotten really good goaltending but caught some bad breaks injury wise.

It was Carlyle's decision to ice a 3rd line in the 3rd period that was incapable of providing any offence. And I'm not sure how you can say there's a talent issue on the top-2 lines.

 

[Strangelove]

I feel like tonight perfectly encapsulated what I find a little strange about all of the Carlyle criticism. I mean, I can count shots on net as well as the next person but I still struggle with the idea that what the team is producing is wildly out of step with the talent level of the club.

Admittedly, I claim no expertise in the area of the Xs and Os and I'm not an advocate of the face punchers, but I still have to come back to the idea that how a coach coaches is secondary to the talent level on a club and where this team is record wise, to me, is reflective of a not very good team that's gotten really good goaltending but caught some bad breaks injury wise.

Not being a very good team is one thing. Getting utterly outworked and outplayed night after night while making obvious errors in judgment with respect to line-ups and line combinations is something else.  And that's not taking into account that fact that a good proportion of the team (offensively and defensively) are underperforming statistically at both ends of the ice, which suggests that there's something wrong with the system the team is playing.

 

[bustaheims]

I feel like tonight perfectly encapsulated what I find a little strange about all of the Carlyle criticism. I mean, I can count shots on net as well as the next person but I still struggle with the idea that what the team is producing is wildly out of step with the talent level of the club.

Admittedly, I claim no expertise in the area of the Xs and Os and I'm not an advocate of the face punchers, but I still have to come back to the idea that how a coach coaches is secondary to the talent level on a club and where this team is record wise, to me, is reflective of a not very good team that's gotten really good goaltending but caught some bad breaks injury wise.

To me, it's the fact that all 4 lines are making the exact same mistakes and have the exact same weaknesses that point to it being more of a coaching/system issue rather than a personnel issue. I won't deny that the team doesn't have the most defensively oriented group of skaters, but, they're certainly capable of being better than they have been if they're tasked with playing a system that works better to their strengths.

 

[Kin]

It was Carlyle's decision to ice a 3rd line in the 3rd period that was incapable of providing any offence.

I suppose. Although it's pretty tough to look at the 12 forwards who dressed tonight and come up with a 3rd line that would have had much in the way of scoring punch.

And I'm not sure how you can say there's a talent issue on the top-2 lines.

Well, I didn't really, although I think tonight highlighted the gap between the Leafs best players and the Crosby's of the world, but rather the overall level of talent on the club.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

I suppose. Although it's pretty tough to look at the 12 forwards who dressed tonight and come up with a 3rd line that would have had much in the way of scoring punch.

Well, Smith-Holland-Kulemin would have at least been comprised of 3 players who know what the offensive zone looks like.

Well, I didn't really, although I think tonight highlighted the gap between the Leafs best players and the Crosby's of the world, but rather the overall level of talent on the club.

Maybe I mis-interpreted that then. But I think a top-6 with as much skill as ours shouldn't really have a problem creating offensive opportunities. Unless of course something/somebody was holding them back.