Unofficial 2012/2013 Armchair GM

[Corn Flake]

Now that Anaheim signed Getzlaf to an albatross contract I am worried that Perry is going to expect the same salary.  I don't think Getzlaf will ever live up to the cap hit let alone Perry if he is signed for a $8 MIL contract.  If Perry was thinking around $7 MIL max for 8 years then I would go for it.  If not the I think Nonis should remain status quo.

I don't know if Perry would command a similar 'Getz' contract, probably not. I've attempted to include some unreasonableness there, however, looking at what Kessel might be able to demand, I'd rather the Leafs have a look at that option regardless.

Also, I'm not sure it's an 'albatross' contract, unless they're flinging bleeding seabird flavour to the crowds or some such...

Perry can certainly argue his numbers are better than Getz, especially in goal scoring where the $$$ usually counts the most.  He's also got a Hart Trophy from '11.  This is the first year in a while.. so far... where Getz is out producing Perry, plus Perry is more of a UFA flight risk than Getz ever was based on the anicodtal evidence we have about family/personal reasons to stay in Anaheim.

If I'm Perry I'm asking for the same contract as Getz to stay and throwing up my hands to question why they wouldn't do that for him too.  Trouble is, I don't think they can pay them both that much within cap and budget constraints.

 

[Britishbulldog]

Now that Anaheim signed Getzlaf to an albatross contract I am worried that Perry is going to expect the same salary.  I don't think Getzlaf will ever live up to the cap hit let alone Perry if he is signed for a $8 MIL contract.  If Perry was thinking around $7 MIL max for 8 years then I would go for it.  If not the I think Nonis should remain status quo.

I don't know if Perry would command a similar 'Getz' contract, probably not. I've attempted to include some unreasonableness there, however, looking at what Kessel might be able to demand, I'd rather the Leafs have a look at that option regardless.

Also, I'm not sure it's an 'albatross' contract, unless they're flinging bleeding seabird flavour to the crowds or some such...

If the Leafs are looking at $6.5 MIL for a speedy, 5'10"  offensively gifted Kessel or $7.0  MIL for a big 6'3" offensively gifted Perry who also has a mean streak I guess you have to go for Perry.  I have liked Kessel's hockey IQ on the ice and haven't really watched Perry to know if he is similar to Kessel and Kadri in creating plays or if he is like MacArthur who has good ideas but tries to force plays that sometimes really blow up in a bad way.

 

[Britishbulldog]

If I'm Perry I'm asking for the same contract as Getz to stay and throwing up my hands to question why they wouldn't do that for him too.  Trouble is, I don't think they can pay them both that much within cap and budget constraints.

This is exactly what I am expecting.  That is why I am drinking the crazy juice and wondering outloud if Anaheim's scout Burke would suggest to get Kessel for the flight risk Perry.  It really makes sense for both teams to me. 

 

[Kin]

Now that Anaheim signed Getzlaf to an albatross contract I am worried that Perry is going to expect the same salary.  I don't think Getzlaf will ever live up to the cap hit let alone Perry if he is signed for a $8 MIL contract.  If Perry was thinking around $7 MIL max for 8 years then I would go for it.  If not the I think Nonis should remain status quo.

I don't know if Perry would command a similar 'Getz' contract, probably not. I've attempted to include some unreasonableness there, however, looking at what Kessel might be able to demand, I'd rather the Leafs have a look at that option regardless.

Also, I'm not sure it's an 'albatross' contract, unless they're flinging bleeding seabird flavour to the crowds or some such...

If the Leafs are looking at $6.5 MIL for a speedy, 5'10"  offensively gifted Kessel or $7.0  MIL for a big 6'3" offensively gifted Perry who also has a mean streak I guess you have to go for Perry.  I have liked Kessel's hockey IQ on the ice and haven't really watched Perry to know if he is similar to Kessel and Kadri in creating plays or if he is like MacArthur who has good ideas but tries to force plays that sometimes really blow up in a bad way.

Isn't Kessel an even six foot?

 

[Andy007]

I have to think there's a deal to be made around Bozak and Liles plus 'x' going to Colorado for one their centres.

Well, there's a bit of a problem there - they can't trade O'Reilly because of the offer sheet, they almost certainly won't trade Duchene and the Leafs probably don't have all that much interest in Stastny with his contract, considering he's on pace for the equivalent of another ~55 point season.

Yeah, I'm not all that keen on paying Stastny 6.5 million to MAYBE put up PPG numbers between Kessel and Lupul in the future.  And they won't trade Duchene for pennies.

I wouldn't mind trying to reacquire Alex Steen from St. Louis.  They are a team looking for defensive help.  Move Kadri up a line and put Steen in Grabovski's role and try Grabovski on Kessel's line and see if anything clicks with Van Riemsdyk.

I agree with this but I think this is also something they can do without a trade. I believe Bozak would flourish in a 3rd line role where he doesn't have to worry about always dishing off to Kessel or playing against another team's top line. Kadri and Grabovski (with some actual offensive talent on his line) could do some real damage and there'd still be quality on the 3rd and 4th lines.

 

[Corn Flake]

If the Leafs are looking at $6.5 MIL for a speedy, 5'10"  offensively gifted Kessel or $7.0  MIL for a big 6'3" offensively gifted Perry who also has a mean streak I guess you have to go for Perry.  I have liked Kessel's hockey IQ on the ice and haven't really watched Perry to know if he is similar to Kessel and Kadri in creating plays or if he is like MacArthur who has good ideas but tries to force plays that sometimes really blow up in a bad way.

I don't have a problem with Kessel either, but he is what he is and IMO Perry is the better player, who also has the accolades to prove it.. a 50 goal season, a Hart Trophy, a Stanley Cup, etc. In what is considered to be his worst offensive season in 4 years, last year he still put up 37 goals. 

I don't think you need to trade Kessel to get Perry on his expiring deal, but some kind of package could make sense.  Don't see the Ducks doing that until after the season though.  They are running too hot right now to mess with chemistry like that, IMO.

 

[Corn Flake]

I have to think there's a deal to be made around Bozak and Liles plus 'x' going to Colorado for one their centres.

Well, there's a bit of a problem there - they can't trade O'Reilly because of the offer sheet, they almost certainly won't trade Duchene and the Leafs probably don't have all that much interest in Stastny with his contract, considering he's on pace for the equivalent of another ~55 point season.

Stastny for Liles?

 

[Champ Kind]

If the Leafs are looking at $6.5 MIL for a speedy, 5'10"  offensively gifted Kessel or $7.0  MIL for a big 6'3" offensively gifted Perry who also has a mean streak I guess you have to go for Perry.  I have liked Kessel's hockey IQ on the ice and haven't really watched Perry to know if he is similar to Kessel and Kadri in creating plays or if he is like MacArthur who has good ideas but tries to force plays that sometimes really blow up in a bad way.

I don't have a problem with Kessel either, but he is what he is and IMO Perry is the better player, who also has the accolades to prove it.. a 50 goal season, a Hart Trophy, a Stanley Cup, etc. In what is considered to be his worst offensive season in 4 years, last year he still put up 37 goals. 

I don't think you need to trade Kessel to get Perry on his expiring deal, but some kind of package could make sense.  Don't see the Ducks doing that until after the season though.  They are running too hot right now to mess with chemistry like that, IMO.

I'm with you on this, CF and BB.  But two things I need to note:

Bulldog, no way - actually, let me rephrase that - NO WAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!  Perry signs for $7M/year.  And NOW WAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  Kessel signs for $6.5M.  The templates start with Getzlaf and Parise contracts.  Kessel will surely come in at $7.5-$8 and Perry will easily receive $8.5.  We can debate whether or not this is an overpayment, but the market dictates value and the comprables are strongly suggesting numbers like these.  And to me, Perry will deliver more value to the team at that cap hit than Kessel can.

Corn Flake, agreed that Anaheim doesn't want to mess with a good thing, but if Perry is a flight risk then this is the time for them to get soemthing of value back.  They could trade his negotiating rights after the season for, what, a second round pick?  Kessel + something for Perry now, with the provision that CP signs long term, is something I would try to grind out.

 

[Britishbulldog]

If the Leafs are looking at $6.5 MIL for a speedy, 5'10"  offensively gifted Kessel or $7.0  MIL for a big 6'3" offensively gifted Perry who also has a mean streak I guess you have to go for Perry. 

Isn't Kessel an even six foot?

I see him listed at 6' in some places but that must be when he is standing on a telephone book.  After a goal you look at the players gathering and although Bozak was listed as 6' originally and now is listed by some web sites as 6'1" he looks a few inches taller on the ice in a scrum with Kessel.

If Kessel is 6' then he is the smallest 6' player in the league.  It is like Orr being listed as 6'3".  Those that I have talked with aren't sure if he is much above 6'2" if even that.

 

[Corn Flake]

Corn Flake, agreed that Anaheim doesn't want to mess with a good thing, but if Perry is a flight risk then this is the time for them to get soemthing of value back.  They could trade his negotiating rights after the season for, what, a second round pick?  Kessel + something for Perry now, with the provision that CP signs long term, is something I would try to grind out.

Still don't think they do it.  I get what you are saying though.

I think the "sign and trade" type deals could increase with that additional year the rights holding team can offer, and the value in return will increase by quite a bit as well.  The paltry 3rd or 4th round pick we've seen move a few days before July 1 type stuff will change.  I think it becomes a 1st round pick type return, maybe more in some cases.

Teams acquiring a pending UFA will have a huge advantage to other suitors if they can offer that additional year. 

 

[Britishbulldog]

Corn Flake, agreed that Anaheim doesn't want to mess with a good thing, but if Perry is a flight risk then this is the time for them to get soemthing of value back.  They could trade his negotiating rights after the season for, what, a second round pick?  Kessel + something for Perry now, with the provision that CP signs long term, is something I would try to grind out.

Still don't think they do it.  I get what you are saying though.

I think the "sign and trade" type deals could increase with that additional year the rights holding team can offer, and the value in return will increase by quite a bit as well.  The paltry 3rd or 4th round pick we've seen move a few days before July 1 type stuff will change.  I think it becomes a 1st round pick type return, maybe more in some cases.

Teams acquiring a pending UFA will have a huge advantage to other suitors if they can offer that additional year.

Kessel and Ashton for Perry.    Go Burke!

 

[Britishbulldog]

I am wondering if any of the rumours leading to the trade deadline have any validity to them or are the media types just reading our ideas/suggestions and are agreeing with them?

Gardiner for Nuggent-Hopkins?

MacArthur for Clowe?

Do those trades make sense for both teams?

 

[Champ Kind]

Corn Flake, agreed that Anaheim doesn't want to mess with a good thing, but if Perry is a flight risk then this is the time for them to get soemthing of value back.  They could trade his negotiating rights after the season for, what, a second round pick?  Kessel + something for Perry now, with the provision that CP signs long term, is something I would try to grind out.

Still don't think they do it.  I get what you are saying though.

I think the "sign and trade" type deals could increase with that additional year the rights holding team can offer, and the value in return will increase by quite a bit as well.  The paltry 3rd or 4th round pick we've seen move a few days before July 1 type stuff will change.  I think it becomes a 1st round pick type return, maybe more in some cases.

Teams acquiring a pending UFA will have a huge advantage to other suitors if they can offer that additional year.

You're absolutely right, hadn't thought of that.  Basketball probably provides a good glimpse of how these things might work.

 

[Corn Flake]

I am wondering if any of the rumours leading to the trade deadline have any validity to them or are the media types just reading our ideas/suggestions and are agreeing with them?

Gardiner for Nuggent-Hopkins?

MacArthur for Clowe?

Do those trades make sense for both teams?

Maybe Gardiner for the bottom 3 pick the Oilers quite likely will end up with again. 

 

[Kin]

I see him listed at 6' in some places but that must be when he is standing on a telephone book.  After a goal you look at the players gathering and although Bozak was listed as 6' originally and now is listed by some web sites as 6'1" he looks a few inches taller on the ice in a scrum with Kessel.

If Kessel is 6' then he is the smallest 6' player in the league.  It is like Orr being listed as 6'3".  Those that I have talked with aren't sure if he is much above 6'2" if even that.

I had thought that they took those heights from the measurements they do at the draft workouts.

 

[WhatIfGodWasALeaf]

I'd move Gardiner for the Nuge, don't see Edmonton giving up on him though.

 

[bustaheims]

I had thought that they took those heights from the measurements they do at the draft workouts.

THey do. Some people just don't believe they're accurate.

 

[maplesyrup]

I'd move Gardiner for the Nuge, don't see Edmonton giving up on him though.

... and not for just Gardiner either.

 

[Jalili]

Back in Boston and in his early days in Toronto Kessel was listed at 5'11. That's probably roughly what he had been measured at in his draft combine.

When you see a guy like a Staal who's listed at 6'4 and certainly looks the part, and then see how short the other players are around him, you start to catch on that there's a numbers inflation for most of their listed heights/weights.

 

[bustaheims]

Back in Boston and in his early days in Toronto Kessel was listed at 5'11. That's probably roughly what he had been measured at in his draft combine.

When you see a guy like a Staal who's listed at 6'4 and certainly looks the part, and then see how short the other players are around him, you start to catch on that there's a numbers inflation for most of their listed heights/weights.

There coudl be, but, the problem in making judgements from these kinds of observations is that you almost never get the opportunity to see players next to each other when they have the same posture and are filmed from the proper perspective.