Opening Forward Lines

[GhostofPotvin29]

All you folks want to witch about him not being on the PP. Randy had it right, you score on it your off it. Sorry, IMO.

Bozak went 18 games last season without a PP point, and he was getting top unit time during that stretch.

See that's what really bothers me.  Maybe there's a method to the madness, but I feel like by the team, media and a lot of fans, Bozak is held to a completely different standard than Kadri.  Obviously there are vocal critics of Bozak's spot in the lineup, but he seems to be able to go stretches like you posted above without general media criticism or lineup demotion whereas Kadri is not afforded anywhere near the same rope.

You would think the one on the top line would get more focus but it seems to be Kadri takes the vast majority of it.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

I wonder if eventually Lupul-Kadri-Booth becomes a line?  But I could also see Carlyle wanting to pair Booth with Santorelli given that they have played well together in the past.

I have pretty low expectations for Booth, I don't know why. I'd rather keep Santorelli on Kadri's wing and have Lupul replace Komarov eventually. But I'd try to keep the 2nd line as it is for as long as we can. They've looked good, and having Lupul-Holland (Lupul was bumped to the 3rd line with Holland and Clarkson today) playing against weak competition could be great.

 

[Arn]

See that's what really bothers me.  Maybe there's a method to the madness, but I feel like by the team, media and a lot of fans, Bozak is held to a completely different standard than Kadri. 

Yeah I think that's what prompted me to make my initial post on the subject - the suggestion in places it was time to move Kadri while Bozak was just ignored.

I actually like Bozak and he does bring certain things to the side. I just feel Kadri gets a very raw deal. And I actually think he's looked very good this season.

 

[Kin]

I think the Leafs were praying that Frattin wouldn't suck and that Lupul would be healthy. Both bad bets to make. As for the PP, I don't expect him to be off of it for long. Randy might have just been doing it to light a fire under him.

I think that's probably true but part of that cluster-fudge is that their B plan(Clarkson) and C plan(Booth, I suppose) are wonky enough bets as is. The troubling thing is that outside of Nylander there really doesn't seem to be the sort of top 6 prospect in the system who is beating down the door and could be plugged in as a Lupul facsimile in case of inevitable injury.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

Jonas Siegel ‏@jonasTSN1050  9m9 minutes ago
Interesting look to Leafs power-play today: Kadri on the point of first unit alongside Kessel, Bozak, van Riemsdyk and Phaneuf.

Could just be a practice thing, but that's one way to get Kadri on the top unit.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

Mark Masters ‏@markhmasters  2m2 minutes ago Toronto, Ontario
Santorelli replaced Holland on 2nd PP unit alongside Lupul-Clarkson; Rielly-Franson at point ? Gardiner not in the mix at practice

And the 2nd unit. Glad to see Santo get a shot there but again Clarkson stays on somehow.

 

[bustaheims]

And the 2nd unit. Glad to see Santo get a shot there but again Clarkson stays on somehow.

Out of everything, I think the insistence that Clarkson stay on the PP, despite not contributing there, bugs me more than any of the other decisions with it. Splitting up Franson and Phaneuf is a smart move, though - assuming they stick with it and actually set things up so both can take advantage of their shots via one-timers.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

Out of everything, I think the insistence that Clarkson stay on the PP, despite not contributing there, bugs me more than any of the other decisions with it. Splitting up Franson and Phaneuf is a smart move, though - assuming they stick with it and actually set things up so both can take advantage of their shots via one-timers.

I know people have been sharing that link Mirtle posted showing the Leafs P/60 on the PP. Taking a different look at that, of the 165 forwards who have played at least 200 minutes on the powerplay in the past 2 seasons, Clarkson ranks 160th in points per 60 minutes. That's 7 powerplay points in 108 games as a Leaf.

And he's dead-last in assists per 60 minutes with just 1 powerplay assist in 108 games.

 

[bustaheims]

I know people have been sharing that link Mirtle posted showing the Leafs P/60 on the PP. Taking a different look at that, of the 165 forwards who have played at least 200 minutes on the powerplay in the past 2 seasons, Clarkson ranks 160th in points per 60 minutes. That's 7 powerplay points in 108 games as a Leaf.

And he's dead-last in assists per 60 minutes with just 1 powerplay assist in 108 games.

While I'm sure the numbers aren't any better, if you're getting 108 games, you're likely using the 12/13 and 13/14 seasons (48 with NJ and 60 with TO). Clarkson has only played 82 games as a Leaf.

 

[Rebel_1812]

All you folks want to witch about him not being on the PP. Randy had it right, you score on it your off it. Sorry, IMO.

Bozak went 18 games last season without a PP point, and he was getting top unit time during that stretch.

See that's what really bothers me.  Maybe there's a method to the madness, but I feel like by the team, media and a lot of fans, Bozak is held to a completely different standard than Kadri.  Obviously there are vocal critics of Bozak's spot in the lineup, but he seems to be able to go stretches like you posted above without general media criticism or lineup demotion whereas Kadri is not afforded anywhere near the same rope.

You would think the one on the top line would get more focus but it seems to be Kadri takes the vast majority of it.

You know you have a point.  Bozak never seems to get criticized for anything in the media.  But then again they don't really criticized any leaf other then kessel, phaneuf and the goalies.  I guess you have to piss the right people off to get criticized by the Toronto media.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

While I'm sure the numbers aren't any better, if you're getting 108 games, you're likely using the 12/13 and 13/14 seasons (48 with NJ and 60 with TO). Clarkson has only played 82 games as a Leaf.

Whoops. Thanks for the note. Looks like hockeystats.analysis doesn't include the current season when looking at stats for more than 1 year. Weird.

So that means that Clarkson has only 3 powerplay points in 82 games as a Leaf.

 

[bustaheims]

Whoops. Thanks for the note. Looks like hockeystats.analysis doesn't include the current season when looking at stats for more than 1 year. Weird.

He also wouldn't qualify as having played 200 minutes on the PP as a Leaf. He didn't get much PP time last season (a little over 1 minute per game). The single PP point he's put up this season, though . . .

 

[CarltonTheBear]

He also wouldn't qualify as having played 200 minutes on the PP as a Leaf. He didn't get much PP time last season (a little over 1 minute per game). The single PP point he's put up this season, though . . .

Yeah if I remember correctly he was used quite a bit early on but then replaced by Raymond.

 

[Heroic Shrimp]

Every Leaf game I watch, multiple times when I see Clarkson, whether it's based on falling down/his positioning/his pass attempts/whatever, I say to myself "I can see why he was never drafted".

 

[Kin]

Every Leaf game I watch, multiple times when I see Clarkson, whether it's based on falling down/his positioning/his pass attempts/whatever, I say to myself "I can see why he was never drafted".

It's interesting because unlike a lot of undrafted players who put up big numbers at lower levels but were too small or whatever...Clarkson's junior numbers just aren't very good. Like as a 19 year old he had 39 points in 55 OHL games.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

Every Leaf game I watch, multiple times when I see Clarkson, whether it's based on falling down/his positioning/his pass attempts/whatever, I say to myself "I can see why he was never drafted".

It's interesting because unlike a lot of undrafted players who put up big numbers at lower levels but were too small or whatever...Clarkson's junior numbers just aren't very good. Like as a 19 year old he had 39 points in 55 OHL games.

I actually had no idea that Clarkson wasn't drafted. AHL numbers aren't even all that good either. I wonder how his career would have gone if his first NHL coach wasn't a Sutter.

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

Every Leaf game I watch, multiple times when I see Clarkson, whether it's based on falling down/his positioning/his pass attempts/whatever, I say to myself "I can see why he was never drafted".

Just on straight up G, A, P his numbers are just so incredibly average relative to the deal he's received: http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/pdisplay.php?pid=62180

Career high of 46 points, career high PPG of .58.  Less than 200 career points in over 500 games.  Barely over a PPG as an OHL overager.  14 points in 44 playoff games.

On pace for 22 goals (with 17% SH right now) and 26 points.  I really don't know what Nonis was thinking.  And his deal has 5 more seasons after this at a $5.25 M hit.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

I really don't know what Nonis was thinking.  And his deal has 5 more seasons after this at a $5.25 M hit.

?I'm not worried about [year] six or seven right now?.

 

[Heroic Shrimp]

I really don't know what Nonis was thinking.  And his deal has 5 more seasons after this at a $5.25 M hit.

?I'm not worried about [year] six or seven right now?.

Well, hopefully, he's at least worried about years two through five like the rest of us.

 

[herman]

I really don't know what Nonis was thinking.  And his deal has 5 more seasons after this at a $5.25 M hit.

?I'm not worried about [year] six or seven right now?.

Well, hopefully, he's at least worried about years two through five like the rest of us.

He's not worried because he knows it won't be his problem well before then.