Randy Carlyle/Leaf Coach thread

[BlueWhiteBlood]

Perhaps Clarkson with Bolland would bring Clarkson to where he needs to be. I still believe in Clarkson and think he will be an asset, I always loved his play with the Devils

As did I. I think he has put too much pressure on himself this year to score, rather than get his nose dirty and focus on the game plan, fore-checking, cycling and grinding it out in the corners.

I think he will be fine and more of what we were expecting next season. Until then, Nonis has to address this coaching problem, the bottom two lines and the defense...

 

[mr grieves]

Tank nation is only good if you're bad enough to get a top 3 pick.  After that it's pretty much a crapshoot each year in the draft.  This Leafs team isn't that bad.

In terms of talent on the roster, they're not that bad. In terms of how they actually play on the ice, I'm not so sure. Their shot differential is right up there with some of the worse teams in the history of the league. Replace Bernier and Reimer with average goaltenders, and the Leafs would be right there at the bottom of the league with Buffalo and Edmonton.

Also, I'd prefer for the team not to end up with another middle of the round pick. That's not likely to bring them the kind of talent they need. If they're not going to make the playoffs and have potential to make some noise there, then I'd like to see them get as high a pick as possible and a better shot of winning the lottery. I'm not at that point yet, but, with the way things are going, I suspect I will be before the trade deadline.

This is basically how their play was trending last season too.  The goaltending was still allowing them to win games in April, but they were getting killed on the shot clock.  44 games played this season, 48 last season.  If last season had been a full season it's very likely we'd be seeing what we're seeing happen now continue.

But last season it wasn't until around game 30 that they really needed Reimer to make up for bad play. This season, they've had better goaltending, which has concealed the fact that they haven't really played differently from the nadir of last season since game... what? 15? Maybe sooner.

 

[Highlander]

Who are the best, very best coaches that are not coaching right now?  Could we look in the AHL like Tampa did?

 

[Heroic Shrimp]

I don't think we've seen the best of David Clarkson in a Leaf uniform yet.

God help us if we have.

 

[bustaheims]

The analogy of an 18 wheeler driving off a cliff wouldn't do that scenario justice. For this team to drop off that badly would be more comparable to the Empire State Building toppling off the Grand Canyon.

5 regulation/OT wins in their last 30 games. The "18 wheeler off a cliff" team had 11 in the last 30 games before Wilson got fired. This team is falling like Mir on re-entry.

 

[Highlander]

Yes but whom are our options in my previous question. Obviously Tampa is doing well with their guy from the AHL?I sort of wish Eakins had been given the chance at the time or told that he was the next in line, he developed most of the guys whom will be on our team in a few years.

 

[OldTimeHockey]

Tank nation is only good if you're bad enough to get a top 3 pick.  After that it's pretty much a crapshoot each year in the draft.  This Leafs team isn't that bad.

In terms of talent on the roster, they're not that bad. In terms of how they actually play on the ice, I'm not so sure. Their shot differential is right up there with some of the worse teams in the history of the league. Replace Bernier and Reimer with average goaltenders, and the Leafs would be right there at the bottom of the league with Buffalo and Edmonton.

Also, I'd prefer for the team not to end up with another middle of the round pick. That's not likely to bring them the kind of talent they need. If they're not going to make the playoffs and have potential to make some noise there, then I'd like to see them get as high a pick as possible and a better shot of winning the lottery. I'm not at that point yet, but, with the way things are going, I suspect I will be before the trade deadline.

This is basically how their play was trending last season too.  The goaltending was still allowing them to win games in April, but they were getting killed on the shot clock.  44 games played this season, 48 last season.  If last season had been a full season it's very likely we'd be seeing what we're seeing happen now continue.

But last season it wasn't until around game 30 that they really needed Reimer to make up for bad play. This season, they've had better goaltending, which has concealed the fact that they haven't really played differently from the nadir of last season since game... what? 15? Maybe sooner.

So the question becomes, what changed? What happened to the Leafs after around game 30 last year that suddenly turned the world upside down for the next 60 games(minus 3 games in the playoffs)?

Did Carlyle change his method? Did the players flip the switch off one day? How do you go from being a competent team to be such a consistent mess?

 

[bustaheims]

So the question becomes, what changed? What happened to the Leafs after around game 30 last year that suddenly turned the world upside down for the next 60 games(minus 3 games in the playoffs)?

Did Carlyle change his method? Did the players flip the switch off one day? How do you go from being a competent team to be such a consistent mess?

Honestly, it feels like the more the team learned how to play Carlyle's system, the worse it got. Remember, teams had really short training camps last season because of the lockout. They had something like a week to get through all the medicals, get in game shape, etc. There wasn't enough time for newer coaches to really teach the system so that it would be in place for game #1. Teams had to learn as the season progressed, and, with the Leafs, that coincided with an increase in shots against and a reduction in shots for. It could be more correlation than causation, but, right now, it's as good a theory as any.

 

[Redleaf]

There's also a theory that this team is too young and inexperienced to be consistent for the duration of an entire NHL season. But I guess that theory doesn't permeate enough with fans and media. It also doesn't lend itself to the never ending criticism of coaches and systems. Go figure.

 

[bustaheims]

There's also a theory that this team is too young and inexperienced to be consistent for the duration of an entire NHL season. But I guess that theory doesn't permeate enough with fans and media. It also doesn't lend itself to the never ending criticism of coaches and systems. Go figure.

Well, that's also because that theory doesn't hold up so well when we're looking at multiple seasons and trends that started relatively early in a shortened season and have progressively gotten worse from the start of this season. It's not so much a consistency issue, either. This team has been very consistent. It's just that they've been consistently poor defensively and in terms of puck possession.

 

[Redleaf]

There's also a theory that this team is too young and inexperienced to be consistent for the duration of an entire NHL season. But I guess that theory doesn't permeate enough with fans and media. It also doesn't lend itself to the never ending criticism of coaches and systems. Go figure.

Well, that's also because that theory doesn't hold up so well when we're looking at multiple seasons and trends that started relatively early in a shortened season and have progressively gotten worse from the start of this season. It's not so much a consistency issue, either. This team has been very consistent. It's just that they've been consistently poor defensively and in terms of puck possession.

Sorry Busta. You lost me at 'Well'.

 

[bustaheims]

Sorry Busta. You lost me at 'Well'.

Let's be honest. I lost you when I decided to put a big chunk of the blame on the coach. So, like 2 months ago.

 

[Redleaf]

Sorry Busta. You lost me at 'Well'.

Let's be honest. I lost you when I decided to put a big chunk of the blame on the coach. So, like 2 months ago.

Oh, I've always been honest. I just see this as a lack of experience issue, and you obviously do not. I'm calling for patience and you're calling for heads to roll. Which is fine. Your argument just gets old when you see it like I do.

 

[TML fan]

There's also a theory that this team is too young and inexperienced to be consistent for the duration of an entire NHL season. But I guess that theory doesn't permeate enough with fans and media. It also doesn't lend itself to the never ending criticism of coaches and systems. Go figure.

Outside of Kadri and Gardiner, everyone in key positions on this roster has played over 200 NHL games. Now, I don't know how many games you need to play to be considered a veteran, but these are hardly inexperienced players.

 

[hap_leaf]

There's also a theory that this team is too young and inexperienced to be consistent for the duration of an entire NHL season. But I guess that theory doesn't permeate enough with fans and media. It also doesn't lend itself to the never ending criticism of coaches and systems. Go figure.

Outside of Kadri and Gardiner, everyone in key positions on this roster has played over 200 NHL games. Now, I don't know how many games you need to play to be considered a veteran, but these are hardly inexperienced players.

Rielly (35 games) and Gardiner (130 games) represent a good chunk of ice time and I am willing to let them make the mistakes you'd expect.

 

[lamajama]

So the question becomes, what changed? What happened to the Leafs after around game 30 last year that suddenly turned the world upside down for the next 60 games(minus 3 games in the playoffs)?

Did Carlyle change his method? Did the players flip the switch off one day? How do you go from being a competent team to be such a consistent mess?

Honestly, it feels like the more the team learned how to play Carlyle's system, the worse it got.

Well I agree with the "worse it got" comment 

For the life of me I'm trying to figure out what Carlyle's system is? At first it seemed to be basically facepunching every game, then as he progressed (regressed...) it's gotten even more confusing. The D zone coverage seems to be to collapse to our net and get so far away from the walls and points that the opposing team has free rein around the outside. Then we get our guys to go chase the puck almost on a 1 on 1 situation. Hence we get our D up at the point still chasing the guy with the puck while the other 4 turn to the puck and watch. Our breakout seems to consist of either 5 foot passes inside our own blueline or 50 foot passes to a Leaf standing still at the red line or far blue line. Offensively we usually chip it in with only the puck carrier attacking or one forward attacking. Whatever style it is, we either have to change the style or the players.

 

[bustaheims]

Hope_Smoke: Dreger "if this team continues to struggle and they miss the playoffs then there will be a full organizational review"

Hope_Smoke: Dreger "this is an improved group that pushed Boston to seven games last spring"

Hope_Smoke: Dreger "the Leafs have had a number of things that went against them with injuries and suspension, but all teams go through that"

Hope_Smoke: Dreger again said that he doesn't think Carlyle gets fired mid-season. He wasn't absolutely denying it though like he has in the past.

Hope_Smoke: In past instances, Dreger absolute in saying that it would not happen. I still think it happens. Can't continue to not show up on the ice

 

[ZBBM]

Who goes by the Hope_Smoke handle?

 

[bustaheims]

Who goes by the Hope_Smoke handle?

Not sure, but they're really just reporting the stuff Dreger and others are saying on various radio programs. And, they run a blog called Hope in the Big Smoke.

 

[ZBBM]

Who goes by the Hope_Smoke handle?

Not sure, but they're really just reporting the stuff Dreger and others are saying on various radio programs. And, they run a blog called Hope in the Big Smoke.

Thanks.  So those were tweets you were quoting?